I think the speed of the bus might be dependent on the location and frequency of stops. Here our buses mostly do the speed limit unless there are several stops within a couple blocks, which I haven't noticed in my travels around town.
I seem to recall reading an article somewhere similar to this, but it was with trains in Europe or Asia. I'll see if I can find it. For something more local, what about WiMAX? Heath Barnhart Asst. Sys/Net Administrator Information Systems Services Washburn Univerity Topeka, KS ----- Original Message ----- From: Lee H Badman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Wednesday, November 19, 2008 8:47 pm Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Wireless coverage for bus riders To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU > No arguments on the science. At the same time, I'd love to hear from > folks that have big honkin' 802.11-based mesh networks, as I've gotta > think there is some from-within-the-vehicle-while-rolling use > occurringon.11 topologies at city driving speeds in these > environments. > > Fully realizing that some of the other lesser known 802.11 working > groups (like .11r) are better suited for reference in this line of > dialogue, I guess I'm thinking that at least on our campus, there's a > fair amount of bus stop-and-go, considering all of the bus stops, stop > signs, traffic-related slowdowns, etc. So if I had a shuttle route of > say a mile and a half, the typical AVERAGE speed of the bus might > be 10 > or 15 MPH, despite the posted limit being 30. Then let's say that the > casual user was trying to do email, or basic web functions for > their 10 > or 15 minutes of suffering through potentially 10 stops until they got > to their own- not enough time to get into heavier activities (if you > mention voice, I'll ignore you)- it seems like circumstantially you > getcloser to being able to pull it off. > > But then there are questions like "and what have you really gained > withall of this?" I do realize. Again, just letting the mind wander > a bit on > the topic. > > Lee > > > -----Original Message----- > From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jonn Martell > Sent: Wednesday, November 19, 2008 9:14 PM > To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU > Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Wireless coverage for bus riders > > Hi Lee, > > The reason why I'm not optimistic about WLAN outside-in for this use > is because it was never designed to provide roaming at anything more > than walking speeds. I'm sure that some vendors are better than > others using proprietary ways but in my vehicular tests on campus, the > roaming capability didn't prove to be a success. Even bicycle speeds > might be too much. > > For a modern day WLAN network to be a success (IMHO), they would have > to implement Enterprise WPA2 and if you think we have > re-authentication fun on a campus mobile level, I can just imagine > doing this at a XX AP per second level while moving on a bus. > > I'd advocate that a per-bus Wi-Fi AP is the best architecture. The > outside-to-outside(WWAN)+inside-to-inside(WLAN) wireless seems to be > the best architecture especially in regards to user experience, > frequency reuse and power management. > > ... Jonn Martell, [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.martell.ca > > > On Wed, Nov 19, 2008 at 5:56 PM, Lee H Badman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote:> Hi John- > > > > Actually some busses have gone the route you describe. Here's one in > San > > Francisco: > > > http://thecityfix.com/the-wireless-on-the-bus-makes-the-wheels-go- > round- > > and-round/ > > and a bus line in Singapore does it as well, for examples. > > > > But back to my notion of outside-in coverage... > > > > If you think about the classic activity of war-driving, you're > typically > > trying to find wireless networks from within a vehicle, which is > largely > > a rolling Faraday cage- just like a bus. I have external > antennas, but > > rarely bother with them during my often very successful, shall we > say,> "explorations" in this area. > > > > So perhaps another somewhat simplistic way of looking at the idea of > > outside-in coverage for rolling busses is that you're setting up a > > really good war-driving target for passengers (as casual users) > to be > > able to "find" and use. Seems like even a less-than-optimal WiFi > > "corridor" along a 30 MPH or less bus route *may* provide > throughputsas > > good as a cellular-based access point that's at one end of a bus > fullof > > signal-attenuating people. > > > > Maybe. Not really trying to prove a point- just free wheelin' here:) > > > > -Lee > > > > > > > > Lee H. Badman > > Wireless/Network Engineer > > Information Technology and Services > > Syracuse University > > 315 443-3003 > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jonn > Martell> Sent: Wednesday, November 19, 2008 7:01 PM > > To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU > > Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Wireless coverage for bus riders > > > > Hi Lee, > > > > I would not even dare to do it with WLAN if the plan is to get > > connectivity to a moving bus from outside the bus. If the goal > is to > > get users connectivity in a non-moving bus, not sure how significant > > that would be for users (how long do buses stay stationary?). > > > > To make it of real use, I would use licensed stuff (3G and 4G) to > the> moving bus and have an AP inside the bus for end-user > connectivity.> Not sure why the transportation and transit systems > haven't gone that > > route (no pun intended!). > > > > ... Jonn Martell, [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.martell.ca > > > > On Wed, Nov 19, 2008 at 12:26 PM, Lee H Badman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > >> In the name of "what if", wondering if any school has installed > >> infrastructure specifically intended to provide WLAN to bus > riders on > >> campus? I'm talking strictly outside-in coverage, no radio magic on > > the bus > >> itself. If so, how's it working for you and just as important, > do you > > get > >> the sense that anyone appreciates it? > >> > >> > >> > >> Regards- > >> > >> > >> > >> Lee > >> > >> > >> > >> Lee H. Badman > >> > >> Wireless/Network Engineer > >> > >> Information Technology and Services > >> > >> Syracuse University > >> > >> 315 443-3003 > >> > >> > >> > >> ********** Participation and subscription information for this > > EDUCAUSE > >> Constituent Group discussion list can be found at > >> http://www.educause.edu/groups/. > > > > ********** > > Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE > Constituent > > Group discussion list can be found at > http://www.educause.edu/groups/.> > > ********** > > Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE > Constituent Group discussion list can be found at > http://www.educause.edu/groups/. > > > > ********** > Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE > ConstituentGroup discussion list can be found at > http://www.educause.edu/groups/. > ********** > Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE > Constituent Group discussion list can be found at > http://www.educause.edu/groups/. ********** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
begin:vcard n:Barnhart;Heath fn:Heath Barnhart org:Washburn University;ISS SysNet version:2.1 email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED] title:Mr. end:vcard
