Dude That is not what I was commenting on. You made the following blanket statement regarding radio links and waveguide:
>If you have any distance at all to go, and you want it to work, you have > no > choice. That is the statement YOU made with your 5 million years of experience. THAT statement could not be father from the truth. There are other choices and they are more cost effective. THAT was the statement that would seriously confuse the less educated population regarding the wireless/RF part of the WISP installation. And when I talk about "less educated" I don't mean someone is stupid. I mean they do not have or have a very limited knowledge base regarding RF and read this list for information. For anyone that doesn't know better they could think the only way they can make a link work is to use eliptical waveguide. And that is incorrect. There are tens of thousands of links running on Heliax/LMR cable and I am NOT talking IF freq here. I'm talking RF out to the antenna. And BTW.....My theory of "WORK" is it does what it is advertised to do with 20 dB of fade regardless of freq band. Puff and Grunt all you want......You're wrong. :-P -B- On 8/20/08 10:48 AM, "Chuck McCown - 3" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > For a passive device, (like a transmission line) the noise figure is equal > to its attenuation. > Sorry for confusing all you less educated people. I guess this isn't the > forum for answers that actually hold up to scutiny. > > [puffs out chest and grunts] > > (I guess my 5000 "carrier grade links" and my 500 miles of licensed > microwave and my 30 years of doing this doesn't count as experience). > Sheesh... > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "Chuck McCown - 3" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2008 8:19 AM > Subject: Re: [WISPA] coax cables > > >> I guess I need to go back to all my customers and remove their equipment >> >> IMHO the statement you made cannot be from experience. >> >> I have more than 500 carrier grade links in the air carrying IP and TDM >> traffic with cable runs up to 150' of 5/8 heliax without a hickup. >> >> It just depends on how its engineered. >> >> Making the statement below is incorrect and only confuses the less >> educated population on this list >> >> Bob >> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: "Chuck McCown - 3" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> >> Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 08:00:51 >> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; WISPA General List<wireless@wispa.org> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] coax cables >> >> >> If you have any distance at all to go, and you want it to work, you have >> no >> choice. >> Transmission line loss adds DIRECTLY to receiver noise figure. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> >> Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2008 6:23 AM >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] coax cables >> >> >>> Eliptical waeguide is also $13 a foot, connectors are over $200 each, you >>> need a bunch of special hardware to hang it and a dehydrator or nitrogen >>> system to keep it dry. >>> >>> I just don't picture the WRAP board group buying waveguide >>> >>> Bob >>> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: "Chuck McCown - 3" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> >>> Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 22:49:24 >>> To: WISPA General List<wireless@wispa.org> >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] coax cables >>> >>> >>> Elliptical waveguide will lose 3 dB in 250 feet. >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Mike Brownson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> >>> Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2008 10:33 PM >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] coax cables >>> >>> >>>> To give you the facts. You can use just about any coax you want. But >>>> you >>>> will have loss. The smaller the cable the higher the loss. >>>> >>>> Examples: >>>> RG8 lose 3 db in 17 ft >>>> LMR400 lose 3db in 26 ft >>>> LMR600 lose 3 db in 40 ft >>>> 1/2 heliax lose 3 db in 49 ft >>>> LMR900 lose 3 db in 60 ft >>>> 5/8 heliax lose 3 db in 64 ft >>>> >>>> >>>> Remember that for every 6dB in loss you lose half your transmit and >>>> receive >>>> range. So with 34 ft of RG 8 instead of 5 miles you get 2.5. So use >>>> whatever cable you can get away with and still have the performance you >>>> need. If you need every miliwatt to be useful then use coax only as a >>>> short >>>> jumper. >>>> >>>> Mike B >>>> >>>> >>>> On 8/19/08 9:45 PM, "Matt Jenkins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> LMR 400? Are you crazy? Heliax 1/2 is the only way to go! >>>>> >>>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >>>>>> It can but the loss is high and the braid is much less. Stick with >>>>>> LMRs >>>>>> 400 *,5 '22@ )+_3 "2,/(:4 32*" 4:+3( >>>>>> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: RickG <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>>> >>>>>> Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 10:33:57 >>>>>> To: WISPA General List<wireless@wispa.org> >>>>>> Subject: [WISPA] coax cables >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I'm running coax down my tower and came across and RG8/U. Can this be >>>>>> used on 5GHz? >>>>>> -RickG >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>> ---- >>>>>> --- >>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>> ---- >>>>>> --- >>>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>> >>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>> >>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>> ---- >>>>>> --- >>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>> ---- >>>>>> --- >>>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>> >>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>> >>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> ---- >>>>> -- >>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> ---- >>>>> -- >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>> >>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>> >>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Mike Brownson >>>> Hutton Communications >>>> 5015 Paris St >>>> Denver, CO 80239 >>>> 303-373-3170 >>>> >>>> This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and >>>> intended >>>> solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are >>>> addressed. >>>> If you have received this email in error please notify the system >>>> manager. >>>> This message contains confidential information and is intended only for >>>> the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not >>>> disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> ----- >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> ----- >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> ---- >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> ---- >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> ---- >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> ---- >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >> >> >> > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
