Hey all, Following up on this thread ...
First off, thanks to those who've offered advice off-list. It's been very helpful. Looks like we're seriously considering Trango Apex 18GHz ... our used Dragonwave lead didn't pan out. A couple other options have come up, too: E-Band's E-Link 1000 (~75GHz licensed, at a promotional price) or Cablefree G1500 (a 780nm FSO product). Anyone have any experience / feedback regarding either of these two products (or companies)? Again, we're trying to create a 1.2 km urban link in an ITU-R rain region K zone, really only need 100Mbps, need ~5 9's of reliability, and sub-$13k (price is an object). Thanks, Adam ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gino Villarini" <g...@aeronetpr.com> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2009 1:48 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ceragon, Dragonwave and whatelse? > You can go Dragonwave 24 Ghz Unlicensed > > > Gino A. Villarini > g...@aeronetpr.com > Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. > tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 > > -----Original Message----- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Adam Greene > Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2009 2:41 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ceragon, Dragonwave and whatelse? > > Just to resuscitate this thread ... > > We have a 1.2Km urban link, really only need 100Mbps, need ~5 9's of > reliability. > > We have deployed Mikrotik 5.3GHz and Radwin 5.3GHz and are getting > interference. We've also gotten interfered with on Alvarion VL 5.8. > > We'd like to do 80GHz Bridgewave, but it's too expensive. > > 60GHz Bridgewave doesn't have enough reliability according to the link > budget calculations. > > Without actually taking a spectrum analyzer to the location, what > suggestion would anyone have about the best frequency & radio to deploy, > to minimize interference issues, get ~100Mbps throughput and not pay > more than ~$13,000 (including advance replacement warranty)? > > We're thinking Trango Apex or Dragonwave ... > > Thanks, > Adam > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Brad Belton" <b...@belwave.com> > To: "'WISPA General List'" <wireless@wispa.org> > Sent: Monday, January 19, 2009 10:56 PM > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ceragon, Dragonwave and whatelse? > > >> Half mile? Ours is almost 2.5miles in an RF unfriendly rain zone. > The >> link >> has been up for more than a year and the client has been thrilled. So >> thrilled in fact that we've got another planned for them with a > roadmap of >> more to follow. >> >> They're happy with the price and we're happy with the profit at that >> price. >> No reason to race to the bottom with yet another product when the > market >> clearly supports the current price point. >> >> Again, what are the options available today that can produce 1Gbps > with >> AES256 encryption at line speed? The encryption alone can be valued > at >> $10k >> - $20k depending on who you ask. >> >> Best, >> >> >> Brad >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] > On >> Behalf Of Tom DeReggi >> Sent: Monday, January 19, 2009 9:24 PM >> To: can...@believewireless.net; WISPA General List >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ceragon, Dragonwave and whatelse? >> >> I fully agree. >> >> I'll add... the value of millimeterwave is 80Ghz, to actually have a >> license >> >> for next to free. The FCC created that for provider's benefit, not for >> manufacturers to charge us more and put the savings in their pockets. > The >> truth is that 80Ghz takes the same cost to make as 60Ghz. But for some >> reason the manufacturers try to charge s premium, a lot more for the >> 80Ghz. >> I get pissed off everytime I think about it. It just holds the > industry >> back >> >> for no good reason. >> >> We aren't to the $8000 figure yet including licenses, but we are > getting >> really close with Trango Apex's. Its just a matter of time, before > Trango >> adds 24Ghz to their line. And Dragonwave is doing 24Ghz pretty darn > close >> to >> >> the goal. Thats my point on why 80Ghz vendors need to get it > togeather >> and >> rethink their business plans. Their high profit ride on the specialty >> short >> >> range market, isn't going to last forever, when 24/23Ghz can do it for > 1/3 >> the price. Most people would rather save money. >> >> They are going to have to bring 80Ghz to the $8 range to keep making >> sales, >> before to long. >> >> I'm not knocking the Bridgewve technology, its a great product. Sure > for >> that half mile link, it can really get the highest capacity to its > buyer. >> But how many of those $30k links will a WISP need? Maybe 1 or 2? I > can >> count 500 buildings off the top of my head that can justify use of a > $10k >> radio. >> >> Tom DeReggi >> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc >> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "can...@believewireless.net" <p...@believewireless.net> >> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> >> Sent: Monday, January 19, 2009 8:52 PM >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ceragon, Dragonwave and whatelse? >> >> >>>A customer came to us looking for gigabit speeds between buildings and > had >>> the money to pay for it. So, we quoted an 80GHz link w/2ft antennas > with >>> over 2 hours of down time and a licensed Dragonwave link that would > do >>> 300Mbps w/5 minutes of downtime at half the price. >>> Once they saw both in the proposal, the response was, "We really > don't >>> need >>> a full gigabit. 300Mbps should be fine." >>> >>> We have both 60 and 80GHz Bridgewave links and Trango Giga and Apex >>> links. >>> Bridgewave's are definitely the way to go for short hops where they > are >>> cheaper than doing a licensed link. However, if Trango or Dragonwave >>> offered a 24GHz link that could do 100Mbps or more for $8k, we'd be > all >>> over >>> it and almost never think of Bridgewave. Obviously Bridgewave's > SLE100 >>> can >>> do it at that price, but even in our urban environment, customers > tend to >>> be >>> outside of the 1/2 mile range. >>> >>> On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 8:15 PM, Tom DeReggi >>> <wirelessn...@rapiddsl.net>wrote: >>> >>>> Brad, >>>> >>>> Well, it can't with 2 radios. But it can with Dragonwave DUO > combining 4 >>>> links for a total of 1400mbps. And Trango Apex at 700mbps is getting >>>> pretty >>>> close. >>>> But that is not my point. I personally do not think that peak > capacity >>>> is >>>> the big factor in a buying decission for WISPs.. >>>> Once you are in the 400mb + range, over subscription is your friend. >>>> >>>> What matters is getting distance, and increasing reliabilty, and >>>> affording >>>> to buy and install as many links as possible. >>>> >>>> WISPs don't need 1GB, but they could benefit from 80Ghz. Bridgewave >>>> needs >>>> more affordable 80Ghz models, that compete with the speeds that > Apexes >>>> and >>>> Horizons can deliver. This is exactly why Bridgewave has been left >>>> behind >>>> this year in sales. WISPs are telling BRidgewave to take a hike, and >>>> embracing companies like Trango and Dragonwave, that have technology >>>> less >>>> trouble to deploy. >>>> >>>> Sure if you need 1GB, and its to the building down the street, OK > then, >>>> Bridgewave can win that one. But 99% of the links that need to be > bought >>>> and >>>> deployed, don't need to be 1GB. I'd rather pay 1/3 the price, and > get >>>> my >>>> ROI in one year. >>>> >>>> Bridgewave also has a hidden cost. The cost to pay for speed before > you >>>> need >>>> it, before customers are reimbursing you for it, and the finance > costs >>>> on >>>> that. >>>> Its ironic to pay finance costs on bandwdith before it is even being >>>> used. >>>> If I have a ROI of one year, I have a much lower finance cost per > link. >>>> Sure >>>> if you have a RUS loan at 3-5% that probably isn't a bad problem. > But at >>>> typical lease fees (20%), that adds up to easily doubling the cost > of >>>> procurement over 3-5 years. >>>> >>>> I've always felt Bridgewave to be overpriced, and because of they >>>> attempt >>>> to >>>> get top dollar for the rare circumstances where it is worth that, > they >>>> loose >>>> huge amounts of market share, to companies like Trango and > Dragonwave, >>>> that >>>> fit a much wider set of diverse needs. >>>> >>>> Tom DeReggi >>>> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc >>>> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Brad Belton" <b...@belwave.com> >>>> To: "'WISPA General List'" <wireless@wispa.org> >>>> Sent: Monday, January 19, 2009 5:49 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ceragon, Dragonwave and whatelse? >>>> >>>> >>>> > Last I checked the DragonWave fell short of BridgeWave in raw >>>> > throughput/payload capacity. The AR80X-AES we have deployed will >>>> > produce >>>> > line speed 1000Mbps with AES256 encryption. I don't think > DragonWave >>>> > can >>>> > pull that off. If so, please share the details as we're close to >>>> > deploying >>>> > another BridgeWave link. >>>> > >>>> > Best, >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > Brad >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > -----Original Message----- >>>> > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org > [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] >>>> > On >>>> > Behalf Of 3-dB Networks >>>> > Sent: Monday, January 19, 2009 4:34 PM >>>> > To: 'WISPA General List' >>>> > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ceragon, Dragonwave and whatelse? >>>> > >>>> > Tom, >>>> > >>>> > The last quotes I have done have put Bridgewave much cheaper than >>>> > Dragonwave >>>> > for 1.2Gpbs... although Dragonwave by far has a range benefit to > it. >>>> > >>>> > Daniel White >>>> > 3-dB Networks >>>> > http://www.3dbnetworks.com >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >>-----Original Message----- >>>> >>From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org > [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] >>>> >>On >>>> >>Behalf Of Tom DeReggi >>>> >>Sent: Monday, January 19, 2009 2:51 PM >>>> >>To: lakel...@gbcx.net; WISPA General List >>>> >>Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ceragon, Dragonwave and whatelse? >>>> >> >>>> >>Bob, >>>> >> >>>> >>I think you are right. (To give Ceragon credit where credit is > due). >>>> >>Although, I'm positive Dragonwave was the first to do it with > 366mbps >>>> >>per >>>> >>radio ODU with Ethernet. >>>> >>Ceragon was stuck at 200-250mbps per ODU for a while there. >>>> >> >>>> >>Its important to note that breaking the 350mbps barrier, and radio >>>> >>combining >>>> >>(for double) was a core accomplishment, that put the value > proposition >>>> >>of >>>> >>6-23Ghz above that of inexistence 80Ghz technology with multiple > hops, >>>> >>to >>>> >>deliver near equivellent capacity, at lower cost. >>>> >> >>>> >>Tom DeReggi >>>> >>RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc >>>> >>IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >>----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>From: <lakel...@gbcx.net> >>>> >>To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> >>>> >>Sent: Monday, January 19, 2009 3:53 PM >>>> >>Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ceragon, Dragonwave and whatelse? >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >>>I believe (but not sure) Ceragon was the first with a DPRM mount. >>>> >>> >>>> >>> But agree with everything else >>>> >>> >>>> >>> :-) >>>> >>> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry >>>> >>> >>>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>>> >>> From: "Tom DeReggi" <wirelessn...@rapiddsl.net> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 12:32:12 >>>> >>> To: WISPA General List<wireless@wispa.org> >>>> >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ceragon, Dragonwave and whatelse? >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> Good advice Bob, but I'll add.... There is a purpose for each > model, >>>> >>and >>>> >>> for >>>> >>> that matter also a specific manufacturer, and all ODU is not > always >>>> >>the >>>> >>> best >>>> >>> choice. >>>> >>> >>>> >>> For example... Trango boasts several core benefits, for some >>>> >>> circumstances. >>>> >>> Its Giga Split archetiecture allows Coax installs to extend up > to >>>> >>1000ft. >>>> >>> (Dragonwave's Coax split Archetecture, still has limits to > 150-200 >>>> >>feet or >>>> >>> so, according to their docs.). Trango's Apex allows optional > Fiber >>>> >>> termination with a very easilly accessible connectors. > (Dragonwave >>>> >>> on >>>> >>the >>>> >>> other hand has the Fiber connectors poorly located, that require >>>> >>taking >>>> >>> the >>>> >>> case apart in order to reach them.) Because of this, for long > cable >>>> >>> deployments, I prefer Trango. Or if on short deadline, and Freq >>>> >>Coords >>>> >>> not >>>> >>> complete, Trango equipment can be ordered in advance of > completion >>>> >>because >>>> >>> they can support more channels per ODU model. (For example, 18 > and >>>> >>> 23 >>>> >>Ghz >>>> >>> only have one ODU Pair choice). Its also important to note, it >>>> >>should >>>> >>> not >>>> >>> be midunderstood the purpose of Trango Gigas's 4 ports. They are >>>> >>Private >>>> >>> VLAN. This is really great for when a link needs to be shared. > For >>>> >>> example, >>>> >>> Port 1 for the customer that paid to get the link installed. > Port2 >>>> >>> for >>>> >>the >>>> >>> ISP's other traffic to serve other clients in the building. > This is >>>> >>> enabled >>>> >>> with zero complexity, that way. The far end switch/router > equipment >>>> >>do >>>> >>> not >>>> >>> need configuration or being the same to accommodate segregation. >>>> >>> This >>>> >>is >>>> >>> not >>>> >>> useful for all installs, but in some cases, this is a unique >>>> >>> benefit. >>>> >>> >>>> >>> Dragonwave offers different benefits... For example... The > Airpair >>>> >>> supports >>>> >>> a whole wealth of different ODU Radios that can be interchanged > with >>>> >>the >>>> >>> Indoor rack unit. If one doesn't buy advanced replacement >>>> >>> warrantees, >>>> >>its >>>> >>> much cheaper to just order in an ODU seperately, than a Full > outdoor >>>> >>> radio. >>>> >>> I'd rather float $3000 to get a replacements ODU in, than > $12,000 >>>> >>> for >>>> >>a >>>> >>> full >>>> >>> Horizon. We'd use All ODU models where we have live backup > links in >>>> >>> place, >>>> >>> and can afford to wait for a Manufacturer replacement. With > that >>>> >>said, >>>> >>> we >>>> >>> love All ODU units, it makes for a much quicker/simpler install, >>>> >>> with >>>> >>Zero >>>> >>> Footprint needed inside. This is great for MTU buildings, where > they >>>> >>need >>>> >>> to >>>> >>> be installed in small closets, or penthouse walls. The > Dragonwaves >>>> >>were >>>> >>> the >>>> >>> first to be able to combine radios for double the capacity, so > more >>>> >>> expandabilty. Airpair offers 25% more capacity than the Trango >>>> >>> giga, >>>> >>> where >>>> >>> split archetecture is needed. Dragonwave offers a dealer > channel >>>> >>> for >>>> >>> those >>>> >>> that will benefit from it. >>>> >>> >>>> >>> Tom DeReggi >>>> >>> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc >>>> >>> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>> From: "Bob Moldashel" <lakel...@gbcx.net> >>>> >>> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> >>>> >>> Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2009 6:37 PM >>>> >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ceragon, Dragonwave and whatelse? >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>>> Well....a couple of notes... >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I personally would use an all ODU version because it makes >>>> >>>> servicing >>>> >>a >>>> >>>> breeze and also swapping out a bad radio quick and simple. No >>>> >>guessing >>>> >>>> about is it the indoor unit, is it the outdoor unit, is it the >>>> >>interface >>>> >>>> cable??? Get an all ODU like the Dragonwave Horizon and you > run >>>> >>>> CAT5 >>>> >>>> and you're done. If you get a cable issue you either can't log > in >>>> >>>> or >>>> >>see >>>> >>>> no handshake with your switch/router or..If one of the POE > lines >>>> >>>> are >>>> >>bad >>>> >>>> your radio will continue to reboot. Troubleshoot the radio on > the >>>> >>ground >>>> >>>> with a patch cable and you rule out your cabling system. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Like was mentioned elsewhere here if you are concerned with > theft >>>> >>>> you >>>> >>>> can lock the radios in place. This can be done by putting a >>>> >>>> security >>>> >>>> screw in place of the grounding screw and use a cable assembly > to >>>> >>lock >>>> >>>> it up. If the theft concern is that high you should probably >>>> >>>> consider >>>> >>>> another location. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> With weather being a concern you could always install a second >>>> >>parallel >>>> >>>> link on the same antenna using a DPRM mount. Then if one link > fails >>>> >>the >>>> >>>> other could be engaged to carry the traffic. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I do not see this link really working (high 9's reliability) >>>> >>>> without >>>> >>4' >>>> >>>> antennas. That of course leads to new mounting issues. At 6 > Ghz. >>>> >>>> you >>>> >>>> are looking at 6' minimum dishes. Figure 600-800 lbs per > antenna >>>> >>with >>>> >>>> mount not to say the least about cost, shipping and > installation. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I personally like Dragonwave for 2 reasons. 1 - The service >>>> >>>> facility >>>> >>is >>>> >>>> in this part of the hemisphere which allows me to get equipment >>>> >>>> overnight in emergencies. 2 - One year advanced replacement is >>>> >>>> only >>>> >>>> $500/year per radio. Allows me to sleep easily. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> This does not mean I do not like Ceragon. They are just doing > some >>>> >>>> growing pains things at the moment and most of the stuff is >>>> >>>> serviced >>>> >>>> overseas unless it is an interface or something simple. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Dragonwave support is very responsive though you do have to > leave >>>> >>your >>>> >>>> name with a service and they call you back. I have installed > more >>>> >>than >>>> >>>> 45 Dragonwave links in the past 2 years and have only had 2 >>>> >>>> failures. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> There are other options but history, price or delivery will > kill >>>> >>>> them >>>> >>as >>>> >>>> an option. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> And stay away from equipment that does switching for you. Do > all >>>> >>>> your >>>> >>>> control external to the radio. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Bob >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Paolo Di Francesco wrote: >>>> >>>>> Dear All, >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> we are considering to move to licensed frequencies for back >>>> >>>>> hauling >>>> >>and >>>> >>>>> therefore some hints would be really appreciated. We are > looking >>>> >>>>> at >>>> >>2 >>>> >>>>> main manufacturers (Ceragon/Dragonwave) so the problem is > "which >>>> >>>>> one >>>> >>>>> fits better for our needs"? >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> Just to summarize: >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> a) links are around 20-25 miles >>>> >>>>> b) antennas: the smaller the better >>>> >>>>> c) robustness is very important >>>> >>>>> d) average life: 3 years >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >From what I have read in the data sheets I have done the >>>> >>>>> >following >>>> >>>>> considerations: >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> 1) Dragonwave Horizon is nice but only if your site is well >>>> >>protected >>>> >>>>> from "sabotage and stealing". The "all outdoor" approach is > nice >>>> >>>>> but >>>> >>it >>>> >>>>> has the drawback that if somebody takes the whole unit they > will >>>> >>have a >>>> >>>>> brand new unit working. With the IDU/ODU approach they will > have >>>> >>only >>>> >>>>> half of the "banknote", so after the first or second time, > they >>>> >>>>> will >>>> >>not >>>> >>>>> spend time having something useless. >>>> >>>>> 2) Dragonwave Horizon can be a problem if you don't use fiber > from >>>> >>the >>>> >>>>> unit down to your switch. In few words, we have sites with > huge >>>> >>amount >>>> >>>>> or EM fields, so even using shielded cables (e.g. Belden > 1300A) we >>>> >>get >>>> >>>>> only few ethernet megabits. So we should use fiber to go up > the >>>> >>tower, >>>> >>>>> but maybe be IDU/ODU approach is more robust (comments > welcome). >>>> >>>>> 3) All outdoor means that when you have to re-use the devices >>>> >>somewhere >>>> >>>>> else, you have to buy a whole new thing instead of just > swapping >>>> >>>>> the >>>> >>>>> ODU. >>>> >>>>> 4) In any case the (all outdoor or IDU/ODU) when the tower is >>>> >>>>> frozen >>>> >>>>> (and when I mean frozen I mean a whole block of ice) then it > does >>>> >>not >>>> >>>>> change much, you have to wait the better season to work on > that. >>>> >>>>> 5) Performances look more or less the same. >>>> >>>>> 6) I don't know much about prices, I have looked on some > website, >>>> >>>>> I >>>> >>am >>>> >>>>> still exploring this aspect >>>> >>>>> 7) Is anybody using the software-switch capabilities on this >>>> >>>>> devices >>>> >>or >>>> >>>>> just using them as transparent bridges for your router/switch? > Do >>>> >>you >>>> >>>>> need to reset them often? >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> Comments are welcome. >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> Am I missing some other good brand? >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> Thank you. >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>----------- >>>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>>> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>----------- >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> >>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> >>>> Checked by AVG. >>>> >>>> Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.8/1899 - Release > Date: >>>> >>>> 1/17/2009 >>>> >>>> 5:50 PM >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>---------- >>>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>---------- >>>> >>> >>>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>> >>>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>> >>>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>---------- >>>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>---------- >>>> >>> >>>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>> >>>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>> >>>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> -- >>>> >>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> >>> Checked by AVG. >>>> >>> Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.9/1902 - Release Date: >>>> >>1/19/2009 >>>> >>> 9:37 AM >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >>>>--------------------------------------------------------------------- > --- >>>> >>-------- >>>> >>WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> >>http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>>>--------------------------------------------------------------------- > --- >>>> >>-------- >>>> >> >>>> >>WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >> >>>> >>Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> >>http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >> >>>> >>Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ---- >>>> > ---- >>>> > WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> > http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> > >>>> >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ---- >>>> > ---- >>>> > >>>> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> > >>>> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> > >>>> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ---- >> ---- >>>> > WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> > http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> > >>>> >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ---- >> ---- >>>> > >>>> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> > >>>> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> > >>>> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > -- >>>> > No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> > Checked by AVG. >>>> > Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.9/1902 - Release Date: >>>> 1/19/2009 >>>> > 9:37 AM >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ---- >> ---- >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>>> >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ---- >> ---- >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>> >>> >>> >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ---- >> ---- >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ---- >> ---- >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> -- >>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>> Checked by AVG. >>> Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.9/1902 - Release Date: >>> 1/19/2009 >> >>> 9:37 AM >>> >>> >> >> >> >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ---- >> ---- >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ---- >> ---- >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > -------- >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > -------- >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > -------- > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > -------- > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
