jesus the mind boggles.. . a can of worms i see opening here..what will you do.?..
woops...my mind is getting dirty share the wife? merle So if I come visit then whatever I do to your property is OK? Because since I'm a human anything I do is 'natural'. Edgar On Oct 10, 2012, at 7:29 AM, Bill! wrote: >Edgar, > >Whether natural processes are 'OK' or not is another kettle of fish. > >Some natural processes may be inconvenient or even destructive to some or all >species. Whether they're 'OK' or not is purely a human judgement. > >Was the meteor strike which caused the ice age (or whatever) and resulted in >the extinction of many of the then existing life forms which paved the way for >human evolution 'OK'? > >It sure was 'OK' for us, but not for tyrannosaurus rex. > >...Bill! > >--- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com, Edgar Owen <edgarowen@...> wrote: >> >> Bill, >> >> By your perverted logic it is totally OK for man to be destroying the planet >> because that's just a natural process. >> >> Grow up and get real. Zen is not clever sophisms, it's reality... >> >> Edgar >> >> >> >> On Oct 10, 2012, at 6:20 AM, Bill! wrote: >> >> > Edgar, >> > >> > What's REALLY important is that it's been framed wrong. It's been framed >> > as humans vs. nature, or as you put it humans 'interfering' in nature. As >> > long as humans think they are not part of nature and taht all their action >> > are natural there will be this problem. >> > >> > When a beaver builds a dam is that interfering with nature? When a >> > squirrel shits in the woods is that interfering with nature? When a human >> > splits an atom is that interfering with nature? When a human manipulates >> > DNA is that interfering with nature? >> > >> > What is the quality that humans have that other animals don't have that >> > renders them capable of interference - IYO? (I just made that up, IYO = >> > 'in your opinion') >> > >> > ...Bill! >> > >> > --- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com, Edgar Owen <edgarowen@> wrote: >> > > >> > > Come on Bill. >> > > >> > > In human discourse about Man's impact on nature, that's the way it's >> > > defined, and the whole issue is framed, as you well know... >> > > >> > > Edgar >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > On Oct 9, 2012, at 8:45 PM, Bill! wrote: >> > > >> > > > Edgar, >> > > > >> > > > This was a VERY SERIOUS response. >> > > > >> > > > Why is it that you think the things that humans do are 'unnatural' or >> > > > against nature but the things that other life does is 'natural' and >> > > > okay? A friend of mine very wisely (IMO)once suggested that all ethics >> > > > should be applied to humans and other life forms equally. >> > > > >> > > > What is the quality that you believe separates humans from the rest of >> > > > nature so that human activities and artifacts can be labeled as >> > > > 'interference'? >> > > > >> > > > ...Bill! >> > > > >> > > > --- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com, Edgar Owen <edgarowen@> wrote: >> > > > > >> > > > > Joe, >> > > > > >> > > > > Come on, it's a serious issue... >> > > > > >> > > > > Edgar >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > On Oct 9, 2012, at 11:26 AM, Joe wrote: >> > > > > >> > > > > > Edgar, >> > > > > > >> > > > > > And Humans are just the tip of the iceberg, too. >> > > > > > >> > > > > > I don't know why plants and animals insist on interfering with the >> > > > > > way Nature works. >> > > > > > >> > > > > > For example, on the early earth there was a nice atmosphere >> > > > > > without oxygen. But blasted Cyanobacteria evolved which like to >> > > > > > sip the methane and other gases there were back then, and started >> > > > > > polluting the atmosphere with ...Oxygen! >> > > > > > >> > > > > > Then -- wouldn't you know -- other organisms formed which turned >> > > > > > CO2 into even MORE Oxygen, with a help from light from the Sun. >> > > > > > The nerve! They got away with it, though, because there were no >> > > > > > Police. The rug was pulled out from under Nature yet again! >> > > > > > >> > > > > > Later, some animals evolved, which USE the oxygen. >> > > > > > >> > > > > > Much later, some of these animals of the Mammal variety called >> > > > > > "Beavers" began to INSIST that they interfere with the stately >> > > > > > FLOW of river tributaries and streams, by ...damming them up! Such >> > > > > > nerve. You may be sure that this caused inundations upstream, and >> > > > > > occasional floods downstream when the dams burst. Havoc. Bye, bye, >> > > > > > Nature! >> > > > > > >> > > > > > The nerve of these organisms: Micro-organisms, Plants, and >> > > > > > Animals. Always interfering with the way Nature works! >> > > > > > >> > > > > > At least on the Moon there is no such interference, there's just a >> > > > > > continual, thin, rain of meteorites pummeling the surface, and no >> > > > > > atmosphere to make things rust. >> > > > > > >> > > > > > Oops!, some exotic Mammals left some footprints on the Moon, and >> > > > > > some machinery, during the last fifty years. WHY must there always >> > > > > > be such interference? The Moon had been Nature's nice, quiet, >> > > > > > haven for rock and dust for so long. Why must things always go >> > > > > > downhill? >> > > > > > >> > > > > > --Joe >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > On 10/7/2012 9:26 PM, Edgar Owen wrote: >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Why do humans always insist on interfering with the way nature >> > > > > > > > works? >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> > >> > >
