After much pondering, Dan R Allen favored us with:
>I'm saying that it should not be absolutely _necessary_ for God to have
>parted the Red Sea, a'la Charlton Heston, to have a testimony that He
>guided the Israelites across it. The fact that He helped them cross the
Red
>Sea is literal, but the exact means described may or may not be symbolic,
>and shouldn't be the basis for a testimony of His power. Could He have
done
>it? Without a doubt. Was it absolutely necessary for Him to prove His
power
>to the Israelites in that specific way? Perhaps for them, but not for me.
John:
How do you apply this reasoning to Jesus calling Lazarus forth from his
tomb, or raising the daughter of Jairus? Maybe these two were not really
dead, but by the power of God they recovered while if it hadn't been for
the blessing they would have died? Is that what you believe? I personally
believe that God performs miracles just like the parting of the Red Sea in
our own day. I predict we will be able to see those miracles in profusion
as this last dispensation draws to a close. If an all out germ war ever
occurs, there will be people dying everywhere of diseases for which there
is no cure and which are 100 percent fatal. In that day, the priesthood
will have to perform healing blessing far more miraculous than are the norm
in our own day. Why? Because in the economy of God's dealings with man,
he is not accustomed to doing for man what man can do for himself with a
little divine help. After all, it was the Lord who inspired the current
medical technology. Why shouldn't he expect us to use it so far as we can?
Dan:
Would they have been any less dead at that time then if modern medicine
might have shown some spark of life? Would what Jesus did be any less of a
miracle? I don't think so. In any case, we are arguing two different things
here.
I believe that God performs miracles today to John, but where are the
explicit examples of miracles like the Red Sea and Jericho today? The
closest examples I know of are the exodus from Nauvoo and the crickets. In
both cases the way He chose to act is much more subtle than that described
in the Old Testament. Why? Are we somehow less deserving of such a miracle
today than they were then? Again, I don't think so. You actually hint at a
pretty good answer to your challenge with this statement: "Because in the
economy of God's dealings with man, he is not accustomed to doing for man
what man can do for himself with a little divine help." Why did God cause a
late freeze when a simple parting of the waters would have worked just as
well?
But getting back to what made me get into this discussion in the first
place; Why should somebody's testimony, presumably given to them by the
Holy Ghost, rest on the interpretation of an ancient event as symbolic or
literal? Your argument that it must, or all is false, doesn't really hold
water because it must be based on the totally accurate translation of an
ancient manuscript at the hands of clearly fallible men.
John:
What about the inventions of nuclear fission bombs? Can anyone deny that
it was a technological leap forward of such an order as to seem like pure
science fiction to all those who lived and died in the pre-atomic era? How
about the Internet? These "miracles" are just as astounding as anything
described in the Old Testament.
Dan:
They were certainly technological leaps, but I wouldn't classify them as
miracles.
John:
If deBakey had lived in Christ's time and performed a heart transplant on
one side of the stage while Jesus commanded Lazarus to come forth on the
other side, which of the two would be thought to have performed the more
miraculous feat?
Dan:
I would have thought Jesus did - He didn't need to make such a bloody mess
doing it.
John:
I feel bad for people who are so "adult" that they no longer have the
wonder and belief that they had when they were children. I am a man who
lives in a world of miracles past, present and future. I believe all these
things because I choose to. It fills my heart with joy to believe them.
Dan:
I too live in a world of miracles. Feeling the touch of the Holy Ghost as I
lay my hands on my child's head and bless them with the strength to
overcome a virus, and sleep calmly through the night - now _that_ is a
miracle.
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
/// ZION LIST CHARTER: Please read it at ///
/// http://www.zionsbest.com/charter.html ///
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
==^================================================================
This email was sent to: archive@jab.org
EASY UNSUBSCRIBE click here: http://topica.com/u/?aaP9AU.bWix1n.YXJjaGl2
Or send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
T O P I C A -- Register now to manage your mail!
http://www.topica.com/partner/tag02/register
==^================================================================
