Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?
2008/8/26 Omer Zak [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Amos presumably needs a working solution TODAY. Promises for bright Not TODAY, YESTERDAY. These monitors are sitting unused for almost a week now. future are irrelevant. If he chooses ATI cards, he should use only 1st reason to justify his choice. This reason may well be enough to make the justification. So with ATI we have an installment plan (Tashlumim) in two steps: * Get working (but limited) solution today (either old cards or proprietary drivers or no 3D acceleration) * Get better support for the *same* hardware on the next upgrade of your distro. Plans of mice and men always change. ATI might fold 8 months from now, or be taken over by nVidia and have its product lines discontinued, or switch to solar powered 3D holographic displays. Where's the second step for nVidia cards? If they are cheap enough, then the following plan would make economic sense: 1. Buy today the cheap nVidia cards (such as GeForce FX 5200, which I chose because of its low price). Thanks for the specific model number. Will look into it. You pretty much nailed it, just like in the other mailing list I asked this question on - nVidia it is, with all the sympathy for ATI's FOSS support. I can only hope right now that next year I'll get to install Ubunutu/CentOS/Debian/Mandrake/whatever instead of the crappy Windows XP/Vista almost everyone here (except about three of us) have on their desktop. My people don't do graphics work, as I said - they do mostly server-side C++ and perl programming. Thanks everyone for your opinions, you've been very helpful. Cheers, --Amos = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?
On Wednesday 27 August 2008, Amos Shapira wrote: 2008/8/26 Omer Zak [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Amos presumably needs a working solution TODAY. Promises for bright Not TODAY, YESTERDAY. These monitors are sitting unused for almost a week now. future are irrelevant. If he chooses ATI cards, he should use only 1st reason to justify his choice. This reason may well be enough to make the justification. So with ATI we have an installment plan (Tashlumim) in two steps: * Get working (but limited) solution today (either old cards or proprietary drivers or no 3D acceleration) * Get better support for the *same* hardware on the next upgrade of your distro. Plans of mice and men always change. ATI might fold 8 months from now, or be taken over by nVidia and have its product lines discontinued, or switch to solar powered 3D holographic displays. Where's the second step for nVidia cards? If they are cheap enough, then the following plan would make economic sense: 1. Buy today the cheap nVidia cards (such as GeForce FX 5200, which I chose because of its low price). Thanks for the specific model number. Will look into it. You pretty much nailed it, just like in the other mailing list I asked this question on - nVidia it is, with all the sympathy for ATI's FOSS support. Great, just great. So while considering all the apathy hang-vidia shows towards open-source, their crappy BLOBs, and they dropping support from older cards, and not releasing specs, etc. - you're still supporting them with your wallet. How do you expect hardware vendors to ever play nicely with open-source operating systems, if even Linux users still buy their products despite their general apathy towards us? So, the real problem is with people like you, who are too pragmatist on their free software ideals, and still support companies like nVidia. I personally am not going to buy a product that's not properly supported under Linux, just so I can be sure I'm not supporting such abusive companies with my wallet. Regards, Shlomi Fish - Shlomi Fish http://www.shlomifish.org/ The Case for File Swapping - http://xrl.us/bjn7i Shlomi, so what are you working on? Working on a new wiki about unit testing fortunes in freecell? -- Ran Eilam = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
When to boycott hardware only partially supported by Linux? (Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?)
On Wed, 2008-08-27 at 15:07 +0300, Shlomi Fish wrote: On Wednesday 27 August 2008, Amos Shapira wrote: 2008/8/26 Omer Zak [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Amos presumably needs a working solution TODAY. Promises for bright Not TODAY, YESTERDAY. [... snipped ...] You pretty much nailed it, just like in the other mailing list I asked this question on - nVidia it is, with all the sympathy for ATI's FOSS support. Great, just great. So while considering all the apathy hang-vidia shows towards open-source, their crappy BLOBs, and they dropping support from older cards, and not releasing specs, etc. - you're still supporting them with your wallet. How do you expect hardware vendors to ever play nicely with open-source operating systems, if even Linux users still buy their products despite their general apathy towards us? I use (relatively) low-end nVidia graphic cards, with the Free 'nv' driver (rather than their proprietary driver). According to the way Amos described his people's needs, the 'nv' driver is enough for their needs. What Amos is voting against with his employer's wallet (if he follows through this plan) is against high-end graphic cards and those features, which require proprietary drivers. For the (relatively) low-end graphic market, nVidia is effectively Free. So, the real problem is with people like you, who are too pragmatist on their free software ideals, and still support companies like nVidia. I personally am not going to buy a product that's not properly supported under Linux, just so I can be sure I'm not supporting such abusive companies with my wallet. Amos' people's display needs are properly supported under Linux using only Free drivers (assuming that my recommendation passes his evaluation). It is an interesting philosophical discussion (which properly belongs to another Linux-IL thread) whether buying a product with features A+B, for use which needs only feature A, and such that feature B is supported only by proprietary software - is a violation of boycott against hardware which is not supported by Free Software. By the way, I still remember the days in which ATI were anti Free Software, and I even signed a petition about this issue. --- Omer -- MS-Windows is the Pal-Kal of the PC world. My own blog is at http://www.zak.co.il/tddpirate/ My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone. They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which I may be affiliated in any way. WARNING TO SPAMMERS: at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?
2008/8/27 Shlomi Fish [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Great, just great. So while considering all the apathy hang-vidia shows towards open-source, their crappy BLOBs, and they dropping support from older cards, and not releasing specs, etc. - you're still supporting them with your wallet. How do you expect hardware vendors to ever play nicely with open-source operating systems, if even Linux users still buy their products despite their general apathy towards us? With all the sympathy and sharing of your frustration, I also have to take into consideration that my employer expects me to take reasonable decisions for the company. It sounds like investing in cards which will not be just plug and play today and wasting my paid time on getting them to work is not a decision he'll look at favourably. Thanks, --Amos = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?
On Monday, 25 בAugust 2008, Amos Shapira wrote: Since there are always swings around about best linux support which I didn't follow, what's the order of the day? Should go with nVidia, AMD or maybe Intel? Any specific card families/models? * Intel would be best: 1. Full OSS drivers on any recent distro. 2. Good integration with the rest of x.org [xrandr etc.]) But They don't sell cards, only on-board chipsets. * My second choice today would be ATI cards: 1. As someone else mentioned older (e.g: r300) chipsets have pretty good support in the FOSS driver (including simple 3D, compiz etc.) 2. AMD/ATI released hardware specs last year and started cooperating with FOSS community, which is significant for the newer cards (http://www.x.org/docs/AMD) 3. Because of (2.), there is better support for modern cards on the pipe. Specifically, David Airlie (one of X.org developers from Red Hat) already announced not long ago about major improvements in r500/r600 chipsets. This is bleeding edge source in his git repository, but it is reasonable to expect this code to land within 6-12 months in fast paced distros (Debian testing, Fedora, etc.) * nVidia have: 1. The best proprietary Linux support ;-) 2. The worst FOSS support. 3. Someone else on this thread already detailed some of the problems it brings (updates, cards with quick End-Of-Life, etc.) * The only worse alternatives than nVidia are all the VIA, SIS and their unloved, binary, non-supported, blobs. Bye, -- Oron Peled Voice/Fax: +972-4-8228492 [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.actcom.co.il/~oron In theory, it's practical. In practice - it's only a theory. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?
On Mon, 2008-08-25 at 19:56 +0300, Oron Peled wrote: On Monday, 25 בAugust 2008, Amos Shapira wrote: Since there are always swings around about best linux support which I didn't follow, what's the order of the day? Should go with nVidia, AMD or maybe Intel? Any specific card families/models? [... snipped ...] * My second choice today would be ATI cards: 1. As someone else mentioned older (e.g: r300) chipsets have pretty good support in the FOSS driver (including simple 3D, compiz etc.) 2. AMD/ATI released hardware specs last year and started cooperating with FOSS community, which is significant for the newer cards (http://www.x.org/docs/AMD) 3. Because of (2.), there is better support for modern cards on the pipe. Specifically, David Airlie (one of X.org developers from Red Hat) already announced not long ago about major improvements in r500/r600 chipsets. This is bleeding edge source in his git repository, but it is reasonable to expect this code to land within 6-12 months in fast paced distros (Debian testing, Fedora, etc.) Sorry, but the 2nd and 3rd reasons to choose ATI exist in the future rather than today. If Amos Shapira can wait a year, then let him buy ATI a year from now. But if he needs a solution today, then several of the above promises are not relevant for him. --- Omer -- Never let beliefs, God or Gods incite war and hatred among human beings. My own blog is at http://www.zak.co.il/tddpirate/ My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone. They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which I may be affiliated in any way. WARNING TO SPAMMERS: at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?
Hi, * nVidia have: 1. The best proprietary Linux support ;-) 2. The worst FOSS support. 3. Someone else on this thread already detailed some of the problems it brings (updates, cards with quick End-Of-Life, etc.) Regarding your 3rd reason: Go pick Geforce 6XXX, 7XXX, 8XXX, 9XXX based card from ANY vendor, and you'll see on nvidia's web site that it's the SAME driver (NVIDIA-Linux-x86-173.14.12 as I write this email), which means any fixes to the driver will be working across the board, and not only that, but new features to the drivers will be working on your OLD card, and the best thing - it works on any modern distribution, be it RHEL-4, Ubuntu, Debian, SuSE, slackware, Mandriva, Gentoo, you-name-it! a simple installer, simple text GUI, does everything for you, all you have to do is restart your X. I can give you an example: In the last year, nVidia added PurePlay HD support to the Linux drivers. Neither Xine nor mplayer supports it, but from my experiece with XP on a low-end Dual core machine with some cheap 8XXX based card, playing blu-ray movies (well, rip off from the media..) with this PureVideo HD plays the video very well on XP while taking only 25% CPU load, and if you have a 7XXX or 8XXX or 9XXX based card, it will work for you as well (well, sort of.. until the guys at Xine or MPlayer or VLC will decide to add the support, its documented and the libraries are installed by default when installing the driver). Want to have some fun? Go take a Radeon 9xxx and try to use their propietary drivers (which has some advantages compared to the standard Xorg drivers) on Fedora 9, Ubunty Hardy or the latest OpenSuSE, good luck with that! how's you kernel hacking skill btw? cause you'll need them since the driver is different from whats available on Radeon 1XXX, 2XXX, 3XXX, 4XXX based cards. * The only worse alternatives than nVidia are all the VIA, SIS and their unloved, binary, non-supported, blobs. Actually, VIA drivers on Xorg are pretty good (well, besides the dual head which you can find tons of complains about it on the net), and they also announced that they'll open source their drivers + specs. SiS = CRAP. period. Hetz Bye, -- Oron Peled Voice/Fax: +972-4-8228492 [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.actcom.co.il/~oron In theory, it's practical. In practice - it's only a theory. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Skepticism is the lazy person's default position. my blog (hebrew): http://benhamo.org = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?
On Monday, 25 בAugust 2008, Omer Zak wrote:
On Mon, 2008-08-25 at 19:56 +0300, Oron Peled wrote:
On Monday, 25 בAugust 2008, Amos Shapira wrote:
Since there are always swings around about best linux support which
I didn't follow, what's the order of the day? Should go with nVidia,
AMD or maybe Intel? Any specific card families/models?
[... snipped ...]
* My second choice today would be ATI cards:
1. As someone else mentioned older (e.g: r300) chipsets have
pretty good support in the FOSS driver (including
simple 3D, compiz etc.)
2. AMD/ATI released hardware specs last year and started
cooperating with FOSS community, which is significant for
the newer cards (http://www.x.org/docs/AMD)
3. Because of (2.), there is better support for modern cards
on the pipe. Specifically, David Airlie (one of X.org developers
from Red Hat) already announced not long ago about major
improvements in r500/r600 chipsets. This is bleeding edge
source in his git repository, but it is reasonable to expect
this code to land within 6-12 months in fast paced distros
(Debian testing, Fedora, etc.)
Sorry, but the 2nd and 3rd reasons to choose ATI exist in the future
rather than today.
If Amos Shapira can wait a year, then let him buy ATI a year from now.
But if he needs a solution today, then several of the above promises are
not relevant for him.
Bzzt. You oversimplify:
* Scenario I:
- Let's assume Amos buys today an old ATI (r300/r400 based)
because he cannot wait.
- He gets reasonable 3D today (One of my Pentiums began
doing compiz a year ago, after a regular update [ATI 9100IGP]).
- Items {2,3} *still* apply, because some of the future
updates would improve even those old cards. For example,
some of the updates Airlie work on, involve adding kernel
modesetting support for the old r300/r400 as well.
(this would help in monitor hotplugging, xrandr, etc.)
* Scenario II:
- Amos buys today an ATI r500/r600 cards.
- Can use FOSS drivers today (no 3D acceleration etc.)
- Or can use proprietary drivers today.
- But because of items {2,3} he would get an *improved*
FOSS drivers within the next year (cleanup, release engineering,
distribution roll out).
So with ATI we have an installment plan (Tashlumim)
in two steps:
* Get working (but limited) solution today (either old
cards or proprietary drivers or no 3D acceleration)
* Get better support for the *same* hardware on the
next upgrade of your distro.
Where's the second step for nVidia cards?
Bye,
--
Oron Peled Voice/Fax: +972-4-8228492
[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.actcom.co.il/~oron
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Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?
On Tue, 2008-08-26 at 00:16 +0300, Oron Peled wrote:
On Monday, 25 בAugust 2008, Omer Zak wrote:
On Mon, 2008-08-25 at 19:56 +0300, Oron Peled wrote:
On Monday, 25 בAugust 2008, Amos Shapira wrote:
Since there are always swings around about best linux support which
I didn't follow, what's the order of the day? Should go with nVidia,
AMD or maybe Intel? Any specific card families/models?
[... snipped ...]
* My second choice today would be ATI cards:
1. As someone else mentioned older (e.g: r300) chipsets have
pretty good support in the FOSS driver (including
simple 3D, compiz etc.)
2. AMD/ATI released hardware specs last year and started
cooperating with FOSS community, which is significant for
the newer cards (http://www.x.org/docs/AMD)
3. Because of (2.), there is better support for modern cards
on the pipe. Specifically, David Airlie (one of X.org developers
from Red Hat) already announced not long ago about major
improvements in r500/r600 chipsets. This is bleeding edge
source in his git repository, but it is reasonable to expect
this code to land within 6-12 months in fast paced distros
(Debian testing, Fedora, etc.)
Sorry, but the 2nd and 3rd reasons to choose ATI exist in the future
rather than today.
If Amos Shapira can wait a year, then let him buy ATI a year from now.
But if he needs a solution today, then several of the above promises are
not relevant for him.
Bzzt. You oversimplify:
* Scenario I:
- Let's assume Amos buys today an old ATI (r300/r400 based)
because he cannot wait.
- He gets reasonable 3D today (One of my Pentiums began
doing compiz a year ago, after a regular update [ATI 9100IGP]).
- Items {2,3} *still* apply, because some of the future
updates would improve even those old cards. For example,
some of the updates Airlie work on, involve adding kernel
modesetting support for the old r300/r400 as well.
(this would help in monitor hotplugging, xrandr, etc.)
* Scenario II:
- Amos buys today an ATI r500/r600 cards.
- Can use FOSS drivers today (no 3D acceleration etc.)
- Or can use proprietary drivers today.
- But because of items {2,3} he would get an *improved*
FOSS drivers within the next year (cleanup, release engineering,
distribution roll out).
Amos presumably needs a working solution TODAY. Promises for bright
future are irrelevant.
If he chooses ATI cards, he should use only 1st reason to justify his
choice. This reason may well be enough to make the justification.
So with ATI we have an installment plan (Tashlumim)
in two steps:
* Get working (but limited) solution today (either old
cards or proprietary drivers or no 3D acceleration)
* Get better support for the *same* hardware on the
next upgrade of your distro.
Plans of mice and men always change. ATI might fold 8 months from now,
or be taken over by nVidia and have its product lines discontinued, or
switch to solar powered 3D holographic displays.
Where's the second step for nVidia cards?
If they are cheap enough, then the following plan would make economic
sense:
1. Buy today the cheap nVidia cards (such as GeForce FX 5200, which I
chose because of its low price).
2. A year from now, ATI releases its gee whiz drivers. Buy top of line
ATI cards to work with those drivers. Their price will be lower than
the price you'd pay if you bought today the ATI cards.
3. Remove the cheap nVidia cards and have them recycled, or donate them
to one of the Linux based school computer labs.
The difference in price of the ATI cards will cover the cost of the
nVidia cards.
Caveat: the above would work unless Amos's people need to develop custom
graphic software which works only with one type of graphic cards.
--- Omer
--
One cannot argue with a Bayesian filter. Peter Lorand Peres
My own blog is at http://www.zak.co.il/tddpirate/
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Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?
On Tuesday, 26 בAugust 2008, Omer Zak wrote: Plans of mice and men always change. ATI might fold 8 months from now, or be taken over by nVidia and have its product lines discontinued, or switch to solar powered 3D holographic displays. Omer, you somehow miss my point. I'm not talking about some abstract future covered with nice ATI promises. This is *working* FOSS code written outside of ATI: http://gitweb.freedesktop.org/?p=xorg/driver/xf86-video-ati.git Please note who host the source, and the names of the commiters (I found only one working for ATI). Your skepticism would have been valid a year ago when ATI promised to improve the FOSS drivers and docs -- at that time it was only words. However, they actually shipped the docs and are actually helping the developers, so we *already* have functional code. The only futuristic part about this is the normal time to test, debug, issue pre-releases (as you can see there were several), have distros package and release etc. This is the normal process done daily by any other FOSS project and any distro. Your argument is equivalent to saying: How can you bank on Java if something would happen to Sun and they won't ship your free software Java implementation? ... Ah, but Sun already released Java as GPLv3. The missing parts have already been completed. It only takes some time for distros to package and ship this work (BTW: some distros like my (anonymous) distro already did it). I'll stop chewing this thread as it must have bored all other subscribers by now. -- Oron Peled Voice/Fax: +972-4-8228492 [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.actcom.co.il/~oron Linux: Because rebooting is for adding new hardware To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?
Hi, I'll go with NVidia if you don't care about open source drivers. They have excellent support in dual screen support. Intel... not very good support. good drivers, but I had my share of a garbage cursor on the 2nd screen. ATI/AMD - Pretty good but PRAY that your card is supported in their latest drivers or else if you find a bug on an older drivers (discontinued card), then that's your problem :) Good luck Hetz On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 1:51 AM, Amos Shapira [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, My boss bought second-hand extra monitors for all of us and I now need to buy graphics cards which can support dual-head for Debian/Ubuntu (and Windows XP and Vista). Since there are always swings around about best linux support which I didn't follow, what's the order of the day? Should go with nVidia, AMD or maybe Intel? Any specific card families/models? The computers are a mix of older (2-3 years?) to new (2 months old), so the system bus might be a bit limited too. I don't need to run games or anything too fancy - just plain programming/surfing and remote desktop, though support for Compiz would be a nice bonus. Thanks, --Amos = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Skepticism is the lazy person's default position. my blog (hebrew): http://benhamo.org = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?
In my PC I have two nVidia GeForce FX 5200 video cards. One with AGP form factor, and the other - with PCI form factor. This was the cheapest way to add a second display to my PC, and worked because my PC had unused PCI slots. Software: Debian Etch, with Xorg version 7.1.0-19. The driver being used is 'nv', for both video cards. The following /etc/X11/xorg.conf section specifies how both screens are combined. Section ServerLayout Identifier DualHead Default Layout Screen 2nd Screen RightOf Default Screen Screen Default Screen Option Xinerama InputDevice Generic Keyboard InputDevice Configured Mouse EndSection I hope this helps. --- Omer On Mon, 2008-08-25 at 08:51 +1000, Amos Shapira wrote: Hello, My boss bought second-hand extra monitors for all of us and I now need to buy graphics cards which can support dual-head for Debian/Ubuntu (and Windows XP and Vista). Since there are always swings around about best linux support which I didn't follow, what's the order of the day? Should go with nVidia, AMD or maybe Intel? Any specific card families/models? The computers are a mix of older (2-3 years?) to new (2 months old), so the system bus might be a bit limited too. I don't need to run games or anything too fancy - just plain programming/surfing and remote desktop, though support for Compiz would be a nice bonus. -- MCSE - acronym for Minesweeper Consultant Solitaire Expert. (Unknown) My own blog is at http://www.zak.co.il/tddpirate/ My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone. They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which I may be affiliated in any way. WARNING TO SPAMMERS: at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?
On Monday 25 August 2008, Hetz Ben Hamo wrote: Hi, I'll go with NVidia if you don't care about open source drivers. I would recommend against Nvidia: http://www.petitiononline.com/nvfoss/ They are completely apathetic towards open-source and Linux, and I have encountered (or heard of people encountering) many problems with them. They don't have their own free drivers or have released SPECs for their cards (the nv driver is written in hex.). I have recently bought a new ATI HD 2600 Pro card to replace my old Nvidia GeForce 4 MX card (whose fan died and that was on the virge of being no longer supported) and am very happy. I wouldn't want to support such a company with my wallet. Regards, Shlomi Fish - Shlomi Fish http://www.shlomifish.org/ The Human Hacking Field Guide - http://xrl.us/bjn8q Shlomi, so what are you working on? Working on a new wiki about unit testing fortunes in freecell? -- Ran Eilam = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?
Hi, I had bought ATI Sapphire HD 2400 PRO for a developer workstation. The card was in mass sales two months ago. The card is working perfect with Debian lenny - July 2008 and with Knoppix 5.3.1. Graphics display and video processing seems fine with xserver-xorg-video-radeonhd video driver. - Moshe. Amos Shapira wrote: Hello, My boss bought second-hand extra monitors for all of us and I now need to buy graphics cards which can support dual-head for Debian/Ubuntu (and Windows XP and Vista). Since there are always swings around about best linux support which I didn't follow, what's the order of the day? Should go with nVidia, AMD or maybe Intel? Any specific card families/models? The computers are a mix of older (2-3 years?) to new (2 months old), so the system bus might be a bit limited too. I don't need to run games or anything too fancy - just plain programming/surfing and remote desktop, though support for Compiz would be a nice bonus. Thanks, --Amos = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Moshe Gorohovsky A6 CC A7 E1 C2 BD 8C 1B 30 8E A4 C3 4C 09 88 47 Tk Open Systems Ltd. --- - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - tel: +972.2.679.5364, http://www.tkos.co.il - = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?
On Mon, 2008-08-25 at 02:06 +0300, Hetz Ben Hamo wrote: Hi, I'll go with NVidia if you don't care about open source drivers. They have excellent support in dual screen support. Intel... not very good support. good drivers, but I had my share of a garbage cursor on the 2nd screen. ATI/AMD - Pretty good but PRAY that your card is supported in their latest drivers or else if you find a bug on an older drivers (discontinued card), then that's your problem :) Good luck Hetz While I'm using nVidia (on a large number of machines) I'm thinking about switching to AMD/ATI. A couple of reasons. A. Having an OSS driver is big plus. While it may or may not use the OSS driver, having the -option- to use an OSS drivers when the binary driver fails and/or you're trying to use unsupported software/OS combo * should be taken into account. If you use nVidia, you're limited to what-ever OS/arch/etc nVidia chose for you. B. The current driver family (16x.xx and 17x.xx) has miserable 2D performance. In nVidia's defense, they are working hard to solve these problems, but as it stands, my 11 y/o PII233/MAC64 laptop, with it's patched DRI driver, literally run circles around my 2xE5335/GF9800GTX workstation in 2D. C. nVidia is a -very- annoying tendency to kill the support for older cards unexpectedly - switching to very problematic legacy drivers. And as you're limited to binary drivers, once nVidia drops to the support for your card, you're screwed. As it stand, if you only require 2D with limited 3D (Read: compiz and friends) an older ATI card (r300/r400-based **) should suite you best. Make sure you do some digging (@google) on the target card before buying it. - Gilboa * Xen under both Linux and Solaris, FreeBSD/AMD64, PPC/PPC64/SPARC/etc. ** 9800*, X300/600/800. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
