How long are your 11ghz links that you want to get more throughput on? I
have a couple 11ghz links that are 3-4 miles that i want to get about
1.4gbps on and I already have one AF11X link up and I was thinking
about putting a AF24 link right on top of that and doing ECMP load
balancing between the two links. I'll have the AF24 radio's set up to
drop ethernet ports if modulation drops to 500mbps that way traffic will
fully fail over to the 11ghz link and hopefully be able to carry the
traffic for the 5 minutes max that the AF24 link is out.
On Sun, Jan 19, 2020 at 3:30 PM Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com
<mailto:af...@kwisp.com>> wrote:
Sorry, you’re right.____
__ __
My brain keeps getting confused by Ubiquiti’s claims of “1.2+ Gbps
throughput” and “greatest spectral efficiency in its class”. It’s
hard to compare Ubiquiti (or Mimosa) licensed band radios to all the
rest. I guess you can view it as “thinking outside the box” or “get
back in the damn box”.____
__ __
__ __
*From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com
<mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> *On Behalf Of *Mathew Howard
*Sent:* Sunday, January 19, 2020 1:56 PM
*To:* AFMUG <af@af.afmug.com <mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] 11 ghz combiner____
__ __
You would need dual carrier, because I'm talking about using the
single core Aviat radios, to keep it as cheap as possible. An AF11
link can typically do ~700M one direction (using both polarities),
which is about the same as each 80mhz channel on an Aviat.____
__ __
On Sun, Jan 19, 2020, 1:36 PM Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com
<mailto:af...@kwisp.com>> wrote:____
I would also run link performance analysis on both approaches.
Or at least consider 2 antennas instead of splitters with the
airFiber approach.____
____
If I take one of my Cambium CCDP (XPIC) links and change it to
ACCP in LinkPlanner, it knocks 9 dB out of the system gain. I
assume due to the additional loss of the splitters instead of
OMTs. And with AF11X radios compared to something like Aviat
you are already starting out with lower system gain. At least
with separate antennas you don’t need the splitters.____
____
I’m also not seeing why you would need dual carrier on Aviat to
match the throughput of two AF11X radios, just make sure you are
comparing apples to apples. In other words, full duplex
capacity, not aggregate. Maybe I’m not familiar enough with the
Ubiquiti and Aviat radios, but it seems to me the appropriate
cost comparison would be 2 x AF11X vs 1 x single carrier Aviat.____
____
____
*From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com
<mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> *On Behalf Of *Mathew Howard
*Sent:* Sunday, January 19, 2020 1:08 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com
<mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] 11 ghz combiner____
____
I don't see how it can be a lot cheaper. Ignoring potential
differences in licensing/coordination, last I checked a complete
AF11 link with all the parts is somewhere in the neighborhood of
$3k (for the hardware only). It looks to me like I can get an
Aviat WTM 4100 with dual carrier enabled for a bit over $7k
total. I'm assuming that I'm going to be able to license
adjacent channels on the same polarity on most paths that I can
license two full AF11 links, and that's going to yield similar
capacity. ____
To me, it seems well worth the difference in price to get
better radios and not have to deal with an extra set of dishes.
Granted, having two sets of radios does give you a redundancy
advantage, but I'd still rather have better radios.____
____
On Sun, Jan 19, 2020 at 11:00 AM Matt Hoppes
<mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net
<mailto:mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net>> wrote:____
Two 11x even with two dishes is still cheaper than an Aviat.
I see the Aviat being an option when we crest 1.4 gigabit.
Until then my dual 11x setup is much less expensive.
> On Jan 19, 2020, at 11:15 AM, Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com
<mailto:af...@kwisp.com>> wrote:
>
> Maybe we should ask what you are trying to accomplish.
Is it more capacity, or something else?
>
> Because if it's more capacity, you will take such a hit
on price and performance using 2 radios and combiners that
you'd be better off with one more conventional radio. You
shouldn't even have to buy a dual core radio to get approx.
double the throughput of an AF11x. Start with the lower
throughput and lower system gain of the AF11X, lose I think
someone said ~7 dB for combiners, pay for 2 radios and
combiners, then need external LAG. It's a Rube Goldberg if
you're just trying to get ~1.5 Gbps full duplex capacity,
just buy one of the alternatives that people have suggested
like Aviat. Or if money isn't a big issue and you want to
license both polarizations (which I believe you need to do
for the AF11X), then buy a true dual core radio with an OMT
and have tons of capacity for the future. Either way, feel
good that you're making efficient use of spectrum.
>
> If capacity isn't the objective, maybe some more info.
>
> If money is the main issue, yes the AF11X is very
affordable, but not if you have to use 2 of them and some
outboard stuff to do what other vendors can do with one radio.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com
<mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of
ch...@wbmfg.com <mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>
> Sent: Sunday, January 19, 2020 8:33 AM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com
<mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 11 ghz combiner
>
> The problem is keeping one transmitter out of the other.
So you have hybrid combiners and circulators. Those are the
only methods I know. You can get both at 11 GHz with
waveguide or SMA connectors.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mark Radabaugh
> Sent: Sunday, January 19, 2020 7:06 AM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 11 ghz combiner
>
> This is usually done using wave guides rather than at the
electrical level due to the high losses that occur when
trying to do it using transmission
> lines. It’s a pretty complex piece of waveguide design
- not something you
> can cobble together. The vendors with full product
lines in the microwave
> backhaul market have these solutions already designed and
available.
>
> Mark
>
>> On Jan 18, 2020, at 4:20 PM, Bill Prince
<part15...@gmail.com <mailto:part15...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> That would be a tall order. AF11 radios are two-pole
already, and the
>> diplexers have a N connector. if you had the right
frequencies; maybe,
>> but it is difficult for me to visualize.
>>
>> bp
>> <part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com>
>>
>>> On 1/18/2020 12:23 PM, Matt Hoppes wrote:
>>> Does anyone know of a 10-12ghz combiner module?
>>>
>>> Example - I want to run two airFiber 11x radios on one
dish.
>>>
>>
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