This is true. I never have liked Nano...
On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 8:44 PM Bill Prince <part15...@gmail.com> wrote:
> +1 Sudo is your friend.
>
> vi is the best editor. Do not argue with me.
>
>
> bp
> <part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com>
>
> On 12/17/2020 6:12 PM, Robert wrote:
>
> sudo su -
>
> passwd
>
> put in a password, and root is enabled...
>
> On 12/17/20 6:03 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
>
> I just rebuilt our librenms server on ubuntu. It doesnt seem bad, lots of
> google answers. Webmin looks cool, dont knownifnits the new webmin or
> because it's on ubuntu. I dont care for the weird adapter naming and this
> yaml thing for configuring them. Commands arent that different.
> Not sure if theres a way to enable root user or not.
> I like that a lot of google advice is nano centric and not vi, I never
> could figure out vi
>
> On Thu, Dec 17, 2020, 7:11 PM Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com> wrote:
>
>> Cool. I hope they change the name though.
>>
>>
>>
>> This is reminding me of Mickey Mouse as the Sorcerer’s Apprentice in
>> Fantasia, when he tries to stop the broom with an ax, only to have the
>> splinters turn into a multitude of brooms.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Bill Prince
>> *Sent:* Thursday, December 17, 2020 6:23 PM
>> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Centos is dead?
>>
>>
>>
>> More options:
>>
>>
>> https://www.zdnet.com/article/cloudlinux-to-invest-more-than-a-million-dollar-a-year-into-centos-clone/
>>
>>
>>
>> bp
>>
>> <part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com>
>>
>> On 12/13/2020 12:42 PM, Josh Baird wrote:
>>
>> RHEL pricing is highly dependent on volume. Nobody typically pays
>> advertised pricing. But, it's still not cheap, especially at scale. You
>> can buy per instance (or guest) or license an entire hypervisor for
>> unlimited instances of RHEL.
>>
>>
>>
>> Your subscription basically allows you to access their repository of
>> updates (think yum/dnf update), knowledge base, and ability to open cases
>> (with some levels of subscription).
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Dec 13, 2020 at 2:47 PM Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com> wrote:
>>
>> Just to cover all the bases, what does it cost to use RHEL? I find their
>> web page a little confusing. Is it $350 or $800? And that’s per server
>> per year, right? Does it turn into a pumpkin if you don’t renew the
>> license every year? That seems pretty expensive especially if you don’t
>> need support and are basically just getting a distribution and repositories
>> for open source software.
>>
>>
>>
>> Actually I’m still a little confused about their pricing. The $350
>> version says no VMs and not intended for production use. Does that mean
>> you are violating the terms of the license if you use it in production, or
>> just their way of saying you can’t open support tickets? And are there
>> add-ons that would be cost yet more for a basic server application?
>>
>>
>>
>> For the first few years I actually used RHEL, I forget if I had to pay
>> upfront or every year. That just does not sound feasible.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Lincs Chel
>> *Sent:* Sunday, December 13, 2020 1:27 PM
>> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Centos is dead?
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Josh;
>>
>> OK. Thanks for expanding your thoughts and info on the Oracle Linux
>> distro and Oracle. It allows one to appreciate the context. This will
>> certainly educate and assist an inexperienced Linux user who is information
>> gathering to make some sound judgements about the CentOS and Oracle Linux
>> distros and where to go.
>>
>> Yeah, I concur with your view that the majority of users that is
>> currently using the free CentOS distro, is most likely going to be seeking
>> the same in any alternative they elect to use as a replacement for CentOS.
>> Also Oracle's past history on acquisitions and Open Source projects
>> certainly makes one really think hard about going into their camp; Java,
>> MySQL, ZFS etc. comes to mind.
>>
>> Most of the Linux training I have come across so far also seems to use
>> CentOS as a start. So this will be interesting as well.
>>
>> Lincoln
>>
>> On 13/12/2020 10:02 AM, Josh Baird wrote:
>>
>> Lincs,
>>
>>
>>
>> One could also say that Stream is also a "direct binary replacement" for
>> CentOS. In fact, to switch a CentOS system to Steam, all you need to do is
>> modify your repo definitions.
>>
>>
>>
>> You are correct, OL isn't meant to be only used for Oracle software and
>> appliances, but it usually is. I didn't mean to insinuate otherwise. You
>> will very rarely find a shop running OL just because they want to.
>>
>>
>>
>> Bottom line - Oracle is a monster that I don't want to get in bed with.
>> I was in the enterprise sector for many years and saw first hand how
>> terrible Oracle's products and software really is. I have watched
>> companies spend *millions* of dollars on Oracle products that are barely
>> functional and could have been replaced with other working solutions at a
>> fraction of the cost. Nothing you say will convince me otherwise :) To
>> each his own, though!
>>
>>
>>
>> Ultimately, I don't believe the majority of CentOS users will want to pay
>> for RHEL/OL. They will just switch to Steam/Rocky/etc or make the move to
>> Debian (which can be a massive undertaking in itself depending on how much
>> time/effort/money you have invested in tooling, etc for EL based distros).
>>
>>
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>>
>>
>> Josh
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Dec 13, 2020 at 8:44 AM Lincs Chel <lhan...@enc-tech.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Josh;
>>
>> An interesting 'emotional' response to the CentOS dilemma . It seems to
>> miss the objective of finding an immediate, short-term and/or possible
>> long-term solution for a CentOS replacement for the community. If you look
>> at the Oracle Linux information, it is a direct binary replacement for
>> CentOS right out of the box; usable right-away. Nor does it appear to be
>> just an appliance based product and only meant for Oracle software. That
>> would be a misleading characterization of their product and to an
>> inexperienced Linux end-user. It's almost suggesting to a person, that you
>> can't run other software on top of Microsoft Windows unless it came from
>> Microsoft itself, or iOS, unless it's from Apple and so on. It does
>> however appear that they (Oracle) are suggesting that you will get a really
>> great experience with their software running on top of Oracle Linux rather
>> than RedHat's version or CentOS or some other Linux distro. I also think
>> Oracle Linux is being positioned for the cloud based network in which all
>> of the big-ones wants to compete head-to-head. Oracle Linux gives Oracle
>> sort of control as to an OS you can readily and easily pick when on their
>> cloud platform that is based on a well known Open Source Linux. Makes
>> sense for them to keep it going. I suspect IBM is positioning itself like
>> that as well. They now have RedHat on their cloud platform and control its
>> direction. They're all aiming for AWS and Microsoft (which has Azure and
>> Windows).
>>
>> Oracle Linux code and/or OS runs without any contortions for the
>> end-user, both experienced and inexperienced Linux users can benefit from
>> this. Essentially one can basically continue running a CentOS environment
>> right now if they wish and/or choose to do so using the Oracle Linux
>> software. And, more importantly without any subscription fees, i.e. for
>> free. I think their subscription pricing looks very reasonable as well for
>> what its worth especially if you're rookie and on a budget. Nothing like
>> hand holding from a single source, than Googling the entire net and wading
>> through tons of blogs and different ideas when you're stuck.
>>
>> Yes, Oracle doesn't appear to always play well with the Open Source
>> community products. But that can be perception. But I would say most of
>> the big companies who use and/or own Open Source software as their
>> business, don't do things the free and Open Source users like all the
>> time. All trying to protect their turf, products and revenue.
>>
>> Oracle can be seen as the 'evil' one, don't trust them with a 10-ft
>> pole. Likewise Microsoft, RedHat, IBM, Amazon, Google, Apple and all those
>> crazy new free-software licensing terms and models software companies.
>>
>> CloudLinux is also an option for a direct replacement. But this appears
>> to be only by subscription only for right now. When I had last checked on
>> it, it was not free and required a subscription that didn't appear
>> inexpensive. But more expensive for someone that is usually accustomed to
>> paying $0.00 for their server software.
>>
>>
>>
>> Lincoln
>>
>> On 13/12/2020 12:16 AM, Josh Baird wrote:
>>
>> Sorry, but nobody in their right mind runs Oracle Linux unless you're
>> using Oracle software and appliances that require you to run OL for support.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Dec 12, 2020 at 10:22 PM Lincs Chel <lhan...@enc-tech.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi;
>>
>> I think another option to consider would be Oracle Linux. Consider the
>> following from their blog, news and website:-
>>
>>
>> - If you are reading this blog, you are probably a CentOS user and
>> are in the position where you need to look at alternatives going forward.
>> Switching to Oracle Linux is easy.
>>
>>
>> -
>>
>> https://blogs.oracle.com/linux/need-a-stable%2c-rhel-compatible-alternative-to-centos-three-reasons-to-consider-oracle-linux
>>
>>
>> - Need a stable, RHEL compatible alternative to CentOS?
>>
>>
>> - https://www.oracle.com/linux/
>>
>>
>>
>> Another option if you're using cPanel & WHM is to most likely use them as
>> a good guide:-
>>
>> - cPanel Support For CentOS 8 And More
>>
>>
>> - https://blog.cpanel.com/centos-8-end-of-life-announcement/
>>
>>
>>
>> And, if you're coming from the old Cobalt Networks RaQ server era days
>> and/or BlueOnyx, they have a good blog, news & comments. Probably their
>> posture may be the best position to take when looking and/or want to
>> "marry" with a particular distro which had various roadmaps during their
>> history.
>>
>>
>> - BlueOnyx has been available on CentOS since CentOS 5, but as the
>> CentOS project never was without issues and unpredictability. Therefore
>> we've never been fully "married" to it. It's always been more of a matter
>> of convenience than one of choice. We even departed briefly from CentOS
>> during the CentOS 6 days and favored Scientific Linux 6 instead. Since
>> then
>> we kept our eyes and ears open for alternatives and also contemplated
>> contingencies.
>>
>>
>>
>> - You are here: Welcome to BlueOnyx» News
>> CentOS Project shifts focus to CentOS Stream
>>
>>
>> -
>>
>> https://www.blueonyx.it/news/280/54/CentOS-Project-shifts-focus-to-CentOS-Stream/d,Simplex%20News%20Detail
>>
>> Based on BlueOnyx website news, they have indicated the original founder
>> of CentOS is considering a possible return:-
>>
>> And like mentioned above: We're not the only ones whom RedHat pulled the
>> rug out from under our feet.
>>
>> In fact Gregory Kurtzer (co-founder of CentOS) had this to say
>> <https://blog.centos.org/2020/12/future-is-centos-stream/#comment-183642>
>> :
>>
>> I am considering creating another rebuild of RHEL and may even be able to
>> hire some people for this effort. If you are interested in helping, please
>> join the HPCng slack (link on the website hpcng.org).
>>
>> Greg (original founder of CentOS)
>>
>>
>>
>> If you've installed and use cnMaestro and Cambium's software on CentOS,
>> then the impact may even be more on your operations. I am guessing
>> Cambium's cnMaestro may drop support for CentOS eventually.
>>
>>
>>
>> Lincoln
>>
>>
>>
>> On 12/12/2020 11:39 AM, Bill Prince wrote:
>>
>> Mostly. IBM charges quite a bit for it, but they're big blue. Not sure
>> what they're getting out of their multi-billion dollar purchase, but we
>> would have to sit in their board room to understand their thinking. I
>> wouldn't be surprised to see that they are saving money by getting all
>> those community developers do the work for next to nothing. Sure cuts down
>> on the expenses in the development department.
>>
>> The only real issue is which version of linux you want hook your wagon
>> to. I used Centos for quite a long time; mainly because it was
>> "enterprise". Then it go too "enterprise" for my taste, and have since
>> switched to Debian. It's the same, but different. Same enough for my taste,
>> and down-homey enough for the small operation we are.
>>
>> NBD.
>>
>>
>>
>> bp
>>
>> <part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com>
>>
>> On 12/12/2020 8:14 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>>
>> Linux... linux is free... right?
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Ken Hohhof
>>
>> *Sent:* Saturday, December 12, 2020 8:39 AM
>>
>> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
>>
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Centos is dead?
>>
>>
>>
>> I guess it would have been naïve of us all to expect no change when IBM
>> acquired RedHat.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On
>> Behalf Of *Steve Jones
>> *Sent:* Friday, December 11, 2020 11:58 PM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com>
>> <af@af.afmug.com>
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Centos is dead?
>>
>>
>>
>> Holy shit, I just took a cursory look at redhat pricing. Starts at 350 a
>> year per server, physical server only, and not intended for production use.
>> 2500 a year for the data center if I read it right
>>
>>
>>
>> I run webmin to manage package updates and BIND. If I'm reading correctly
>> ubuntu isnt terrible, just less security patched since it's all opensource
>> and not subsidized by a big dog like red hat. Probably doable, but no yum.
>>
>>
>>
>> Has something like this happenned with centos historically? I assume the
>> linux community will bring about a comparable solution or resolution.
>>
>>
>>
>> This just stinks, I had my centos process down.
>>
>>
>>
>> Is this end of life like a microst end of life where they just keep
>> patching and saying they mean it this time for years?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 11, 2020, 11:28 PM Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com> wrote:
>>
>> Supposedly there will be CentOS Stream? Kind of like RHEL beta instead
>> of RHEL day old bread. I guess their answer would be if you are using it
>> in a production environment you could always pay for RHEL. Or there’s
>> Fedora. I believe Preseem runs on Fedora.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Mike Hammett
>> *Sent:* Friday, December 11, 2020 10:19 PM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com>
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Centos is dead?
>>
>>
>>
>> Debian is like Ubuntu ,only better. ;-)
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>
>> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>
>> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
>> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
>> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>
>> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>
>> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
>> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
>> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
>>
>>
>> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> *From: *"Steve Jones" <thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>
>> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" <af@af.afmug.com>
>> *Sent: *Friday, December 11, 2020 5:12:13 PM
>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Centos is dead?
>>
>> I've been a peasant my whole life, is there any other way?
>>
>> I think powercode is ubuntu now, so I'll probably go that route, are
>> there major differences to it?
>>
>> I dont like saying ubuntu, too much like ubnt
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 11, 2020, 3:47 PM Seth Mattinen <se...@rollernet.us> wrote:
>>
>> On 12/11/20 13:21, Steve Jones wrote:
>> > Am I reading all this right? Redhat officially killed centos and its
>> > tombstoned in 2021?
>> >
>> > Everything I run is centos. It's not like I know centos but I have my
>> > resource sets on where to go to resolve anything that pops up.
>> >
>> > Is this just a normal thing in the linux world where something is ended
>> > but actually just rebrands and keeps going or is it a legit end of the
>> OS?
>>
>>
>> It happens. Someone will probably fork it and make up a new distro if
>> that hasn't happened already. IMO the main reason to use CentOS was
>> because it was rebuilt RHEL.
>>
>> I gave up on Red Hat about two releases into Fedora Core when it became
>> obvious it was just rapidly changing garbage for testing on the peasants
>> before bringing fixes into their commercial version.
>>
>> --
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