I think you are confusing the result of solving the immigration issue with solving it. I don't disagree with you. With our current welfare state, and maybe without it, illegal immigration helps keep our standard of living as high as it is for even the poor. My point was how to solve what many see as a huge issue, not the impact of doing so. On others escaping persecution, poverty, etc. Honestly, what about the other hundreds of millions facing the same or worse circumstances? You think their horrific circumstances negate a countries right to determine its own immigration policy?
On drugs. You are correct. I have never used drugs. I think you may be confused on my proposal though. I never said that the currently addicted would be affected one way or the other by the severity of the punishment proposed. Like it or not those people are lost until they choose not to be. But others not so addicted would be affected and that progress could be rapidly tracked by how many first time users are arrested and it would take less than a year to see if harsh punishment was likely to make an eventual impact. Those ideas might be worthless, but no more so than what is currently in place. On Sun, Mar 13, 2016 at 9:08 PM Josh Reynolds <j...@kyneticwifi.com> wrote: > Some are here for jobs, some are here to escape massive corruption and > drug cartels. These are jobs that most American's don't want to do - either > the work is "too hard" or pay "too low" - which really the latter is true. > I came from a farm community (Kentucky Tobacco) and have seen how hard they > work. Many have two or three jobs, and they share a trailer and a truck. > They take shifts sleeping on the available beds, and send most of their > checks home to their families to take care of them. Some save to bring > their families here. Very few of these workers were paid minimum wage, but > they were often given a trailer to stay in (for the group). Rows and rows > of trailers per farm. > > You deport these guys, American agriculture will suffer. The farm > subsidies get sucked up by the conglomerates, and the regular guys get very > little. > > The drug demand has nothing to do with illegal or legal. Have you ever > done any drugs? Ever? My guess is no, but I've been wrong before - ask my > wife! Drugs are an escape, a booster, and the harder ones are ruthlessly > addictive, both physically and psychologically. Just once or twice is > enough to make it very difficult if not impossible to overcome by yourself, > if ever. And they are SO CHEAP (meth, heroin). > On Mar 13, 2016 8:49 PM, "Lewis Bergman" <lewis.berg...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Really, you think we would have massive illegal immigration if we had no >> jobs being offered then? >> You also believe that if nobody demanded drugs there would be people >> killing each other to get it here? >> We can disagree on if punishing a drug user is either right it would make >> any difference on then wanting the drug. But you surely cannot argue that >> it is demand that drives the supply, not the other way around. >> My point is just that the demand for cheap labor and the willingness to >> break the law to get it drives illegal immigration. I think you are letting >> your desire for penalty fee drug use get in the way of your judgement. >> OK, I made that last part up but you really don't understand the basics >> of supply and demand? >> >> On Sun, Mar 13, 2016, 8:08 PM Josh Reynolds <j...@kyneticwifi.com> wrote: >> > agreed >>> >>> Legal or illegal, has nothing to do with drugs. If people want to do >>> something they will. >>> On Mar 13, 2016 7:28 PM, "Jerry Head" <li...@blountbroadband.com> wrote: >>> >>>> " Kind of like the drug problem. As long as you don't penalize the user >>>> you get increasing demand." >>>> >>>> This has got to be one of the most ignorant comments I have ever seen >>>> on this list. >>>> Wow.... >>>> >>>> On 3/13/2016 6:35 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote: >>>> >>> I agree with that. Kind of like the drug problem. As long as you don't >>>> penalize the user you get increasing demand. If you don't punish the >>>> employer you get increasing demand. >>>> >>>> On Sun, Mar 13, 2016, 2:56 PM Jaime Solorza < >>>> <losguyswirel...@gmail.com>losguyswirel...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> Far less than many believe.... you need documentation which of course >>>>> can be faked...but percentage wise more welfare in southern states. Most >>>>> undocumented workers fend for themselves holding two or three shit jobs no >>>>> one wants. See who is working on highways late at night or in hot sun in >>>>> Texas...a white foreman and ton of Hispanics.... I have travelled just >>>>> about every rode in Texas.... go to Chile harvests in Hatch,NM. Like I >>>>> said..no demand, no supply.... simple Adam Smith theory in action. >>>>> On Mar 13, 2016 1:06 PM, "Lewis Bergman" <lewis.berg...@gmail.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Immigration should have been unfettered in 1893 because there was no >>>>>> welfare state in existence then. The combination of unrestricted >>>>>> immigration and a comprehensive welfare system has the potential to >>>>>> bankrupt the U.S. I have no idea if immigrants make up a larger part of >>>>>> the >>>>>> welfare system than any other, just that the potential is there. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Sun, Mar 13, 2016, 11:35 AM Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>
