I agree that sensory representations are critical to intelligence... But the literature on the congenitally blind does not support your assertion that graphical, geometric representations are central to their thinking...
For example, recent research shows that for blind people, the brain reorganizes so that the self-concept is represented auditorially rather than visually http://brain.oxfordjournals.org/content/134/1/235.full.pdf The important thing is sensory representation, not visual/graphical representation specifically Lots of relevant papers at http://www.seeingwithsound.com/newpubs/congenitally_blind/ e.g. "Beyond motor scheme: a supramodal distributed representation in the action-observation network" which shows that perception-action integration is not bound to any particular sense modality... So if you have respect for empirical data, you should stop harping on vision/graphics, and harp on sensory representation more generally instead... -- Ben G On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 10:53 PM, Mike Tintner <[email protected]> wrote: > Jeez, Ben, how many times do you and others have to repeat this canard? > > See the research on how blind people can draw. They draw the outlines of > objects, which they have obviously learned by touch. We have multiple senses > and graphics are the way to bind most of them. Graphics are fundamental to > nearly all our senses because they represent the outlines/frameworks of > objects and the . outlines/frameworks of scenes. Knowing the name/letters > arbitrarily associated with objects, is not remotely as important as > learning the shape of things. You don't handle an A-P-P-L-E. You handle a > real apple, and understanding and being able to process its outlines is > kinda essential for both handling and visually recognizing it. > > Similarly, the rigid graphics and frameworks of geometry are fundamental for > mathematics, just as notches/lines are fundamental to numbers. But hey you > don't like graphics and visual stuff, so just ignore it all, and see how > far you get. > > > > -----Original Message----- From: Ben Goertzel > Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2013 3:31 PM > > To: AGI > Subject: Re: [agi] A General O.D. (Operational Definition) for all AGI > projects > >> Concepts themselves are a whole different medium. They're primarily >> GRAPHIC/FIGURATIVE - pictographic/ideographic. Our concept of APPLE is >> not >> a set of letters but a graphic of the real thing, connected to more >> detailed >> sub-photographic/common sensical images of the real object. > > > And that is why the congenitally blind have no concepts ;-p ... > > > ------------------------------------------- > AGI > Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now > RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/6952829-59a2eca5 > Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?&; > Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com > > > ------------------------------------------- > AGI > Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now > RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/212726-deec6279 > Modify Your Subscription: > https://www.listbox.com/member/?&; > Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com -- Ben Goertzel, PhD http://goertzel.org "My humanity is a constant self-overcoming" -- Friedrich Nietzsche ------------------------------------------- AGI Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/21088071-f452e424 Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?member_id=21088071&id_secret=21088071-58d57657 Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com
