On Mon, 08 May 2006 15:37:52 -0400, Karel Demeyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
Firstly, which guidelines are you using ? What's your source of
information ?
probably his own common sense as a guideline, same as me :D maybe I'm
wrong for Harry, but definitely myself as a guideline for me :p
Op za, 06-05-2006 te 15:30 +0200, schreef Harry Vennik:
Okay, I was working on a new proposal, told Karel on MSN, and then he
replied
he was just updating his, and I decided to complete mine and then
compare
them before sending mine. And yeah, much is the same (especially in
'Account', 'View' and 'Help').
A quick overview of the differences:
- Mine lacks the 'MSN Messenger Status' in the Help menu, but I think
it is a
good idea to add it, I just did not think of adding that.
- I left out 'Enable sounds' and 'Plugins'. I do not see why having
those in
the prefs window would not be enough. I kept the 'Preferences' item in
the
'Account' menu though, because having a 'Tools' or 'Settings' menu did
not
really survive in the discussion. There are simply not enough items to
put
there, so having it as a menu is not justified.
I'm ok with having "plugins" in preferences eventually, but I'm kind of
unsure. Asking around at #openusability:
scapor: Regarding usability, is it best to have {en/dis}able'ing plugins
in hte preferences window of an application or in a "plugins" window on
it's one ?
(...)
janushead: scapor, thats a condensed question
(...)
TarasBulba: (...) other issues: is preferences menu bloated? are there a
lot of plugins that make the software value go a lot higher? generally
speaking, if the software menu is not complex, than one may consider to
put it in a (...) menu or a seperate place - personally i don't see a
barrier in both..
So ... a poll ? :)
I would say in a menu, I prefer having too much than not enough, even if
too much means bloated, I think in this case, we have enough gap for us to
play with that we can add that without being bloated yet.
"Enable sound" is something you would change more often than any other
preference imo. We also have it in the tray-icon context-menu. For me,
it is "in the menu" but if you want a poll about this .. go on.
no poll, it's a much more often used option than anything else, it's as
important as 'change status' imho.. although I never use it (always set to
off)
- I added a few things that were missing, and would be helpful. Most of
them
just popped into my mind while looking at some context menus in aMSN,
or the
MSN8 menus as sent by Youness.
- I removed the actions menu. Some of its items went into the 'Contact'
menu.
This distinction ... I made it on purpose ! Menu's shouldn't be too
long. As also plugins can add stuff in here, and they're likely gonna
be things that might fit in my "Actions" menu
- I removed sort groups ascending/descending
Why ? It's a View thing ... ppl might like it .. no ?
ok, for the last two comments, I agree with you, I also noticed this in
Harry's design, it seems he tries to make it as small as possible, to
condense the menus, give it a little diet.. it's not the best way to do it
imho, I agree with Karel.
- I moved the Load/Save contact list into the Account menu. I already
told why
in my previous e-mails.
I know why you think it's ok. I'm also not 10O% against the idea;
My design consists of a "me" menu ("account") and then a "contacts" menu
(aka "the others"). Saving a list of contacts seems more a "about the
others" action then a "about me" action, though, I know, they're MY
contacts and it's tus related to one particular account. Furthermore,
the account menu is getting quite big, so for this reason, when I'm
thinking about 2 menus, I rather place it in the smaller one.
this is ambiguous, you guys decide, I'm 50/50%
- I modified the order of the items in the main menu bar, as well as in
some
menus.
Here is my proposal:
Account Contact View Help
==================================
===Account===
Log in as ...
Log in
Log out
---
Change nickname...
Change display picture... // NEW
I'm ok with this though I'd put "My status" on top of this group as you
change your status more often. whenn it's only 2 items in a group, it
doesn't matyter that much but when you have three it's better imo.
good point
My Status >
---
Go to Inbox
My profile
---
View received files
Show events history
---
Load contact list
Save contact list
---
Preferences
---
Minimize to tray
Close
===Contact===
Add new...
Remove
---
Send a message
Send sms
Send email
Send file... // No need to say 'file or photo' ;-)
that's just naming and depends on the translation
it is, but if you already start coding it, then it's an important detail,
once we have a key translated we rarely change it.. so it's better to put
it right from the beginning...
btw, OT, search dialog keys are not translated yet... (ctrl-F from
chatwindow..)
---
View chat history
View webcam sessions
---
New group...
Rename group...
Remove group
---
Block // NEW
Should not be a group on it's own, rather put it between "Add" and
"Remove". this is a good addition but needs (a little bit) coding
for this (and the things below), as it requires new code, I suggest you
put a -command [list msg_box [trans featurenotimplementedyet]]
or similar...
---
Properties
===View===
* Show contact with nickname
Show contact with email
---
Sort contacts by status
Sort contacts by group
* Sort contacts in hybrid mode
---
x Hide empty groups // NEW
x Hide offline contacts // NEW
I saw this in the MSN8 menus and I liked it. But, are you gonna code
it ? Before the coding is done, I'd want to implement it the old way as
I did in my design. This however is much better and should be done
later on. Maybe in a newer CL code ...
I agree.. but disagree (as always :P), you're right, the things in msn
menus are good, but it doesn't fit in amsn.. we have status/group/hybrid,
and he adds hide empty groups, and hide offline contacts...
first, hide empty groups is an advanced preference and will most probably
be used once (should be in appareance, not in advanced), also, it's mostly
usefull in hybrid mode only.. it could be added, but I don't really think
it's place is there (one-time option makes menu bloated imho)
hide offline contacts... "wtf does it mean ? will it do the same as
collapsing the 'offline' group?" that's the question I kept asking myself
when I was trying to figure out what's wrong with that option.. I think we
should keep the same thing as in MSN8 :
GROUP offline users
GROUP mobile users
not hide.. by grouping, you mean add an additional group... but now, if
you choose to add "group offline users", it means the 'hybrid' mode
disappears, because hybrid mode is simply 'sort contacts by group' with
'group offline users' enabled... right ?
the group mobile users option is self-explanatory...
---
Change global nickname ...
===Help===
Contents
FAQ
Online help
---
Send feedback // NEW
---
About aMSN
Op zaterdag 6 mei 2006 14:11, schreef Karel Demeyer:
> Not much changed, though I took a look at what youness wrote down
about
> MSN8 and watched their menus, and incorporated the "minimise" action.
>
> Karel.
>
>
> These are not anymore in this menus-proposal:
>
> [OFF] amsn versioncontrol -> in about window
> This was removes because it's not very much used anyway and only
> populates
> screen real-estate. whe a user checks the version he/she has in the
> about
> window, he/she should be able to check for the latest release in
there
> too.
>
> [OFF] minimise instead of close -> in preferences
> This is something only set once. From usability point of view it's
> even
> wrong to minimise a window (to the tray) when the close button is
used
> as
> this should do the same as the "close" entry in the main menu.
Though,
> this is an often requested feature, so it should be kept, and it's
> place
> is in the preferences window.
>
> [OFF] Change language -> in preferences
> This is a preference mostly only set once and thus belongs in the
> preferences screen.
>
> [OFF] Change skin -> appearances in prefs
> Idem dito.
>
>
>
> This is the proposal:
>
> ===Account===
> Log in as ...
> Log in
> Log out
> ---
> Change Nickname ...
> My Status >
> ---
> Go to Inbox
> My profile
> ---
> view received files
> show events history
> ---
> Enable sounds
> Plugins
> Prefs
> ---
> Minimise to tray icon
> Close
>
>
> ===View===
> Sort contacts by status
> Sort contacts by group
> * Sort contacts in hybrid mode
> ---
> * Show contact with nickname
> Show contact with email
> ---
> Change global nickname ...
> ---
> * Sort groups ascending
> Sort groups descending
>
>
>
> ===Actions===
> send a message
> send sms
> send email
> ---
> send file or foto
> send webcam
> ask to see webcam
>
>
> (the first actions might become a submenu (all but "message" when
> pluhgins add some stuff, same lagic ass in contextmenu)
>
>
>
> ===Contacts===
> add a contact ...
> remove a contact ...
> Contact properties
> ---
> New group
> Rename group
> Remove group
> ---
> view chat history
> view webcam sessions
> ---
> save contactlist
> load saved contactlist
>
>
>
> ===Help===
> contents
> FAQ
> online help
> ---
> MSN Messenger status
> Send feedback (also for bugs .. we shouldn't call it "bugs" in here
> anyway)
> ---
> about aMSN
>
>
>
>
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