> When I think of "Christian values," I think of such things as > honesty, > charity, love for your fellow humans, not stealing, not > murdering, not > committing adultery (which by definition involves someone who > is married to > another and therefore damages that family, which may include innocent > children), honoring your parents, etc., most of which I would > also classify > as "civilized values" (as in "IAAMOAC"), so when you say that you > "personally do not agree with most Christian values," I'm > curious which > particular values you don't agree with . . .
The 10 Commandments have some good values, that fit within the boundaries you speak of (Civilized Values) but the commandments were not created by Jesus, but by Abraham (alright - he didn't, but he did bring them down from the mountain). Christians definitely do not hold the monopoly on these values you speak of. I can't think of a religion that does not hold those same values as their own. I will remind you of the 10 commandments before I give you the list of Christian values I don't like. ONE: 'You shall have no other gods before Me.' TWO: 'You shall not make for yourself a carved image--any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.' THREE: 'You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain.' FOUR: 'Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.' FIVE: 'Honor your father and your mother.' SIX: 'You shall not murder.' SEVEN: 'You shall not commit adultery.' EIGHT: 'You shall not steal.' NINE: 'You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.' TEN: 'You shall not covet your neighbor's house; you shall not covet your neighbor's wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor's.' While the 10 commandments were not a Christian construct, attempts were made to "change" the commandments to reflect the new Christian values. "Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?" Jesus replied: " 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.' This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.' All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments" (Matthew 22:36-40)." As you can see, Christian values place God above all, then fellow man. The individual, family, or Mankind is not mentioned. Neighbor implies local, vs. global. I am sure there are other places where Jesus refers to "love your fellow man" in the global context, which only illustrates the many convoluted interpretations of what it mean to be a Christian. With enough contradictions, logic suggests that being a good Christian near impossible. Here is the list of values I do not agree with: Opposition to Abortion rights Supremacy of Church over Family or the individual Intolerance to vastly different religions Belief that one's God should protect one in war, over one's enemy Belief in the Original Sin Belief in Creationism Opposition of teaching evolution Supremacy of KJV bible over other canon Opposition to Homosexuality Altruism Penance Supremacy of Privacy between church leaders and liturgy (?). Belief that Christian values are the only good values or that if one does not believe in Christian values, that one has no values The tying of being Moral or being Ethical as being Christian. The belief that Christian values are exclusively "family" values Belief that those that choose to not believe in Abraham's god are doomed to Hell Reliance upon faith as a basis for the formulation a set of ethics, morals, and values The only true justice is Christian justice (eye for an eye). The right to pray in school (see how popular that idea is if schools started broadcasting Moslem Prayer calls over school intercoms...) Jesus primarily preached Justice, Humility, and Love. I am for this (of course). I think most every non-Christian is as well. The differences come into play when we discuss what is meant by each of these values, Justice, Humility, and Love. ( I am generalizing, for sure, but bear with me.) Justice Christian - Commutative Justice (Eye for an Eye) Buddhist - Belief in Karma, Justice too much like revenge. Islam - Justice is the basis of God's acts. Love Christian - Love God and Christ first, then your fellow man. Buddhist - Love oneself first, then others Islam - Love only one God, Allah, then all else, for the sake of God, and in the name of God. Humility Christian - Strong requirement for worship and entry into Heaven Islam - Strong requirement for worship and entry into Heaven Buddhist - That which is most pursued. You may reply back that those beliefs are generalized, and outdated, that modern Christians are more liberal, or that I may just have it wrong. But before you do, I would kindly ask that you ask yourself whether or not you really align as closely as you think you do to Christian values. You mention a list of Christian values, but you failed to mention God's importance in the priority or order of value. I'll ask the tough question now. If attaining Utopia required everyone on Earth to become a non-Christian, would you give up Christianity? I'm not saying this is true, but I am challenging your notion of love of civilization over love of Christ. Alas, I have given more than enough today to insure I will get an online thrashing. I want you to see how _I_ see Christian values, in a more broad context. Is it less about the Values themselves, as much as it is the priority of those values (God over Man, Gospel over Man, Gospel over Family, Family over Individual). Nerd From Hell > > > -- Ronn! :) > > God bless America, > Land that I love! > Stand beside her, and guide her > Thru the night with a light from above. > From the mountains, to the prairies, > To the oceans, white with foam... > God bless America! > My home, sweet home. > > -- Irving Berlin (1888-1989) > > > _______________________________________________ > http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l > _______________________________________________ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
