----- Original Message ----- From: "Erik Reuter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Killer Bs Discussion" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2003 9:02 PM Subject: Re: On the topic of atheism.
> On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 07:33:28PM -0600, Michael Harney wrote: > > > For an atheist to say "There is no god, and people who believe in any > > god or gods are just deluding themselves". Requires faith. This > > statement, while > > On the other hand, a slight change in your statement to: > > There is no evidence for god, and people who believe in any god or > gods (without evidence) are just deluding themselves. > > does not require faith. > I think it depends completely on what one means by "God". If one is thinking about some being that has any constraints or limitations, I would agree with you. But if one is describing a being that is omnipotent, omniscient, eternal, and infinite, then minds such as ours could not encompass even the scope of such a being. We may not even be able to recognize evidence of "Gods" existence for what it is, considering how little we actually know about the universe and the nature of reality. In such a case, the facts are unavailable, the truth is unknowable, and any adherence to the polar extremes of the question "Does God exist?" is absolutely a matter of faith. Lately I've seen discussion about faith, atheism, and agnosticism. Count me as a 4th category. I say it doesn't matter. I believe that whether "god" exists or not, we are still required to observe a common morality and ethics. Required by either "God" or by our humanity in general, the end result is the same. Speaking honestly, I pray. But I do not claim that I know that my prayers are heard and I have never heard "God" speak to me. I pray because it makes me feel good, closer to the part of me that cares. Mostly I pray for others and on rare occasions for myself. (Praying for myself seems selfish, I'd rather work for the results I want.) I suppose you might say that for me "God" is like schroedringers cat, "God" exists in an indeterminate state, and since I am not in position to "observe" "God", "God" cannot be collapsed into fact or fiction. But I won't claim that the distinction concerns me beyond the realm of curiosity. xponent The Return Of Freewill Maru rob _______________________________________________ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
