> abortion practicioners offices. I think its fine and I also think it
> offers the women who are going to have abortions some balance.
I agree even though they annoy me. Largely these are personal things - After a year and half a dozen rosaries, don't they know yet that I'm just from a different nearby office? Or in their worldview am I supposed to be pressuring this guy to move? Also, I don't like people giving me rosaries. I find that I can't throw them out because they are sacred objects :) yet I can't give them away because I don't agree with all they represent :) So they collect on my rearview mirror, possibly to do me some good if I get pulled over, I suppose.
I do think that if you are really trying provide an alternative to abortion -- rather than just shaming the women who are having one -- that there are better outreach methods than sitting in front of the parking lot. And I don't thing that you should give sacred objects to people indiscriminately. Most of them will throw them out and rosaries in the trash strikes me as wrong.
> I don't consider a fetus a child. We are working on getting pregnant
> NOW and I assure you i will not find the fetus in any way endearing
> until much later along in my pregnancy than I would consider abortion
> responsible. Is a fertilized chicken egg a chicken? hell, no, its
> just a red spot in the yolk. Its still really an egg.
This will of course vary by person and it's really too personal a definition to argue. I can tell you that I knew immediately when I became pregnant. On the other hand, do I really think that four cells=a person, no. Not yet. I think that happens around self-awareness, and viability is as good a place as any to guess as to where that happens. I also think that the distinction between life and potential life is kinda irrelevant, but this is something where reasonable people may differ and my views on this are quite possibly colored by too much Catholic church when I was growing up :)
> Murder is bad, religious or not. Morally bad. I am using it in the
> moral sense.
No quarrel with that. You need to define murder though. I just got into the religious aspects because you said I was bringing them in, and I did say it was a sin a while back, which is definitely religious. I think my religious beliefs are irrelevant to this debate though and am actually pro-choice. If you were actually trying to take issue with John, fine.
Dana
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: dana tierney
> To: CF-Community
> Sent: Saturday, June 05, 2004 4:45 PM
> Subject: Re: Conversation Topic - Abortion
>
>
> Some fine lines here. When I said abortion was a sin, that was a
> religious concept. When you say it is murder, I assume you are using a
> legal definition since you are an atheist or agnostic, right? If not,
> a moral one? What is it? Because in the legal definition there is a
> distinction
> between life and potential life, and it doesn't seem like a bad best
> guess to me.
>
> I do think that since the anti-abortion people have the slogan that
> "She's a child, not a choice" that the pro-choice tend to over-react a
> bit to the term. I personally use it because what I know about
> pregnancy comes from talking to obstetricians, and that's the term
> they use when discussing risk tradeoffs, for example whether it's ok
> to have carpal tunnel surgery in the second trimester of pregnancy.
>
> I also think that it is much easier to be in favor of abortion if you
> do not think of the fetus as a child. This is just a matter of
> definition, really, depending on the stahe of the pregnancy and on
> whether "child" is defined to include only post-natal juveniles.
>
> I dislike all the emotion that the anti-abortion guys throw around. I
> see plenty of it because someone in our parking lot apparently
> performs abortions. The entrance to the parking lot is picketed 3 days
> a week. Much as it annoys me to be offered a rosary and pictures of
> dead babies every time I go into or out of the parking lot, those
> people have a right to be there. And in their point of view they are
> possibly saving lives. Certainly they are making a stand...this has
> been going on for anout a year on and off (sigh)
>
>
>
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