-Caveat Lector-
----- Original Message -----
From: nurev <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, June 11, 1999 3:20 AM
Subject: Re: [CTRL] Revising Capitalism/ rebuttal.
> -Caveat Lector-
>
> SCIO-LTD wrote:
> >
> > -Caveat Lector-
> >
> > Let me address some of your false conclusions as follows nurev: (and
let's
> > dispense with the puerile value judgements, "You get a little self
serving
> > here don't you buddy?" )
>
> I don't think I care to dispense with my value judgments, and there
> was
> nothing puerile about pointing out your self serving statements.
Everything you say is purile, you have less sense than I previous supposed,
as you have so aptly shown.
>
> > [Without competition to balance greed, the system is sold under false
> > pretenses.]
> >
> > the system is sold under false pretenses? Utter nonsense! competition
in no
> > way balances greed, indeed competition is the result of greed and is its
> > active force in commerce.
>
> We are saying the same thing. Greedy GE and greedy Westinghouse
> compete to
> sell you a refrigerator by offering you a lower price. This is the "
> Magical
> Mystical Market " at work. This of course is bullshit, since the
> companies
> are part of an oligopoly and often collude to fix prices.
some are some aren't.
>
> But Capitalists keep spouting on and on about " invisible hands " and
> other
> superstitious crap.
agreeded
>
> >
> > [Adam Smith who made the case that with competition the system benefits
> > all, and, without competition we are simply destined for some form of
> > slavery. Smith made clear that without competition the system is merely
an
> > oinkfest for oinkers and wanabe oinkers. He didn't much like
businessmen. He
> > saw them as greedy, conspiratorial, and obsessed with money. Some things
> > never change.]
> >
> > Adam Smith, that racist communist, read Anton Chaitkins Treason in
> > America ---- from Aaron Burr to Averall Harriman, for a detail treatment
on
> > the heretical pronouncement this fool made and how his writings have
became
> > a tool to propagandize the opposite of what he seems to stand for,
>
> Racist? Communist? Heretic? Compare him to thieves like Fallwell,
> Robertson,
> and the Pope.
Who is talking about them? Again who gives a fuck about the pope or
Falwell, stick with the subject at hand, if you can.
>
> The Pope has finally started to gently chastise capitalism now that he
> is no
> longer afraid of being put out of the lucrative god business by the
> Commies.
> He must after all. Jesus did say that it's easier for a camel to hump
> a
> Dachshund, than for a rich man to get to heaven.
No He didn't, (that's biblical bullshit, your's for that matter for
misquoting the Word, what an idiot you are, He said it is easier for a camel
to go through the eye of the needle than for a rich man to enter into the
kindom of heaven.
>
> > the
> > statement above is a non-sequiter, that doesn't address the what the
> > relationship between competition and business. As for businessman
being
> > greedy, conspiratorial, and obsessed with money, indeed some are, but as
> > with most generalized statements it is patently wrong. There has always
> > been that breed of merchantislist (which is who Adam Smith was
addressing
> > here who sought to out right monopolies everything.)
>
> Oh please. Sell it somewhere else. This is a list which is more than
> familiar
> with the machinations of businessmen. Go to the archives and save the
> bullshit.
dismissive aren't we, especially since again you haven't a clue about what
your talking about.
And yes I've been to archives, it really doesn't say much about businessmen,
fool.
> and
> > [No??? Why no? Does this make capitalism good?]
> >
> > There needs to be a distinction between an aspect or attribute of
capitalism
> > and its core tenets.
>
> This is irrelevant. It's behavior which drives an economy, not theory.
> It's
> greed which drives thieves and their paler alter egos, capitalists.
wrong again fool, solypsystic bullshit, and this is what your extensive
experience leads you to believe
>
> > Monopolies are not capitalism but are a feature of it in the global
economy,
> > there are private as well as governmental monopolies. The most obvious
and
> > glaring example of monopolist action which stifles innovation is the
> > electric utility industry which is on the verge of technological
> > obsolescence, which is raking up enormous profits while actively
suppressing
> > innovation. go figure.
>
> I have figured. It makes money. Innovation is not important unless it
> makes
> more money for the same people.
see above
>
> >
> > [ Wrong. Sheer greed has ALWAYS been the driver of capitalism.]
> > bullocks, bullshit, balderdash, complete sheer and utter crap.
> > Greed is not the driver of capitalism, you would impute that wealth
> > formation is an evil activity,
>
> That is precisely what I impute.
so be it. .
>
> > it is only is when the rights of others are
> > violated in its acquisition.
>
> Now you've got it. If one can get rich from one's own labor, then one
> deserves
> all that he worked for. If one gets rich off of someone else's labor,
> that is
> theft. There is not enough time in a lifetime to accumulate fortunes
> based on
> one's own work.
Wrong, but you really won't know that you're not wealthy.
>
> > Wealth is good and desirable.
>
> Even that is a wrong assumption. Although I'm sure you need to believe
> otherwise. Wealth in society behaves like a dense star in space. It
> distorts
> EVERYTHING towards itself. This is why the rich get richer, wealth
> concentrates
> into the hands of the very few, the have nots become a destabilizing
> force, and civilizations collapse.
Dense star in space, are you off your fucking rocker, heh, heh, heh(there
coming to take me away ha ha), Dude the only thing that is distorted is you
views. civilizations collapse for a variety of reasons.
>
> > However most
> > people including yourself it seems confuse wealth with mal intent.
>
> It takes mal intent to accumulate it. It takes mal intent to make it
> grow. It
> takes mal intent to keep it. Yeah. I guess I'm right.
Your guess is . . . guess? WRONG again!!
faulty reasoning will always
>
> > Obviously, wealth has been use to cartelize the world economy, it has
been
> > use to prohibit the free exchange of ideas to other nations, it has been
use
> > to subjugate and use the common and natural resource for a foreign gain.
>
> ... and then you say...
>
> > Is
> > wealth or its formation a bad thing. I say no a thousand times.
Sorry you can't grasp concepts, but everyone has their limits. Hammers
have been you used to bash peoples heads in well I guess that just makes
hammers bad. NO YOU ARE THE FUNNY GUY!!!! (alot people laugh when
they read that, sorry sport)
>
> Your a funny guy. Ha ha ha ha.
>
> > Remember it is the love of money, and not money itself which is the root
of
> > all evil.
>
> Don't quote me that biblical crap. It's both. And you don't expend
> energy
> to get rich unless you love money and what it can get you.
Watch you mouth, you haven't a clue about most things in particular, read
the statement again fool, for thou art one.
>
> > [That's right. Pet rocks, hair in a can, minimum wages, externalization
of
> > costs, and a petroleum based automotive industry 100 years old which
will
> > not change as long as capitalists have the oligopoly in the oil
industry.
> > That's innovation baby. What % of innovations are really advances for
> > humanity? I don't know. Vare to guess?]
> >
> > The fact that we can communicate our ideas is an advance.
>
> Yes it's an advance. So what. Beating drums was also an advance.
> Television
> was an advance with enormous potential. Look what capitalist
> innovators did
> to the best damn learning tool ever invented to date. If businesses
> are
> permitted to control and dominate the NET, then its potential will be
> pissed
> away too.
beating drums an advance? You're really going out of your way to prove your
ignorance, so far as the net it's too late.
>
> > Pet rocks,
> > hair in a can? Who gives a fuck? (you're more intelligent than that:
aren't
> > you). minimum wages, yadda, yadda yadda, features of some
capitalist,
> > not capitalism. Let me clear the cobwebs from your understanding.
The
> > computer industry alone, is responsible for a great deal of innovation
and
> > material benefit.
>
> Oh come off it. I'm in the computer industry. It put millions out of
> work.
> It's tedious , annoying, inefficient, labor intensive, poorly
> conceived and
> executed, and will wind up costing everyone much more than any
> benefits it
> brought. We can discuss this after next New Year. If cars ran as
> poorly as
> computers, we'd still have to keep horses.
If you're using Bill Gates stuff I understand your frustration, but you
choose your " tedious , annoying, inefficient, labor intensive, poorly
conceived and executed, and will wind up costing everyone much more than any
benefits it brought." job
>
> % wise, who knows, why ask a question you can't
> > yourself quantify, unless you are speaking rhetorically?
> >
> > [ I am assuming here that folks agree that monopoly is a baaad thing.]
> > Absolutely categorically agree with you.
>
> And I would guess that you agree with me because your business is
> still in
> a competitive stage. If you were Bill Gates you wouldn't agree with
> me.
> Would you?
All businesses are continually in a competitive stage, it simply doesn't
end.
>
> > [What bullshit! People don't eat information. You get a little
self-serving
> > here don't you buddy? The internet has promise in several areas, none of
> > which are necessary for sustaining life.]
> >
> > Did I say people eat information?
>
> C'mon. Stretch a little here. I know you can do it.
I repeat " Did I say people eat information?"
>
> > What a fantastic leap in logic you've
> > accomplished. I sorry you can't understand what is patently
understandable.
> > People thrive on information, data and intelligence, yes it is necessary
to
> > life, schools, training institutes and news agencies, the government
> > (unfortunately the largest producer of information), businesses; media,
> > entertainment all feed an open mind.
>
> But feed it what? People have gotten stupider and more distracted.
really. . . . ?
>
> > It is the driver for wealth
> > acquisition.
>
> Oink, oink.
Ok PIG
>
> > If I know something then I am in a position to act on it.
> > This fact was known a long time ago. Remember man shall not live by
> > bread alone but every word that proceedith out of the mouth of God.
>
> God and money. What a combination. Let me remind you that Jesus hated
> and fought against the rich. This is why they had him killed. He
> threatened
> the source of their wealth, which came from collaborating with the
> Romans in
> exploiting the land and the people. The ordinary people wound up as
> virtual
> slaves and hated the Romans and their own rich enough to revolt. The
> rest,
> as they say, is history.
Jesus didn't hate the rich, look at Nicodemus, dude read your Bible, no they
killed him because He claimed He was the Son of GOD, brought Him up on the
charge of blasphemy, and crucified Him. GET IT RIGHT!!
>
> Look, you want to make a lot of money? Go ahead and try. But don't try
> to
> justify your avarice with bullshit.
FUCKOFF DICKHEAD. I DON"T NEED to justify shit to you,
>
> " Say it strong.
> Say it loud.
> I'm a pig,
> and I am proud!"
YOU MUST BE, PIG
>
> Joshua2
>
> >
> > ============================
> > Jeffrey C Hearon
> > Founder & CEO
> > SCIO-LTD
> > http://www.scio-ltd.net
> > http://www.scio-ltd.com
> > http://www.scio-ltd.org
> > ============================
>
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>
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>
DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==========
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing! These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.
Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.
========================================================================
Archives Available at:
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http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
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