On 6/4/24 04:26, gene heskett wrote:
On 2/19/22 06:31, Andrew M.A. Cater wrote:
Hi Gene,

If this was someone calling you from a TV station saying they had a TV
transmitter that was varying in power output - you'd have a mental checklist.
You'd get down there, perhaps schedule some sort of power down / reduced
power operation and then you'd check - power supplies, feeder cables, hot
spots on cables - whatever. Divide and conquer- working back to a baseline
of known working conditions and eliminating causes.

My suggestion to you of a reinstall is partly designed to get you out of this
"X happens, I did Y, now I've got Z" - to get to a known initial state.

Take out all the serial converters to UPS, lathe and so on. Wireless keyboard
doesn't present as serial in the same way that brltty does - if it did, I'd
have brltty with every install on this laptop.

Copy off your home directory as you did before - maybe using tar.gz and 
preserving permissions. Start with the .iso that includes firmware - the 
unofficial one.

Build back slowly - do an expert text mode install if you can. Then add your
Trinity desktop - I don't think any of us can help you there, since we don't
run trinity.

Check and you should find that brltty isn't installed at all. Then re-add 
thingsgradually until you have the working system you want. Document it - write 
down
the steps you take / copy configuration files you change.

That will also reveal logging / login slowdowns or whatever caused by
individual devices as you add them back. Keep a list as you go.

That's the counsel of perfection: alternatively:

apt rdepends brltty gives me:

me@mymachine:~$ apt rdepends brltty
brltty
Reverse Depends:
   Suggests: speechd-el (>= 3.7.2)
   Depends: brltty-espeak (= 6.3+dfsg-1+deb11u1)
   Suggests: orca
   Depends: brltty-x11 (= 6.3+dfsg-1+deb11u1)
   Depends: brltty-speechd (= 6.3+dfsg-1+deb11u1)
   Depends: brltty-flite (= 6.3+dfsg-1+deb11u1)

You could try apt-get remove (or equivalent) on each of those packages and
see if that clears it. I _know_ this is frustrating as all get out for you
but a clear approach, written down so that you can remember where you got
to will be very helpful.

If all else fails, you can then share it with the list and say "I got to
step X with no problems, then Y happened - help me out here" and we'll
have some better idea. We all jib at you for being vague/not indluding
details but otherwise it is all just guesswork for the usual folk that
hang out here.

All the very best, as ever,

Andy Cater

How much longer till trixie is officially out??  What you are proposing sounds like several days work, and i have other irons in the fire. This release has been such a disaster for me because the install insists on installing and configuring orca and brltty w/o asking. I've done 40 some installs now, trying to stop it from wasting about a second while its yelling every keystroke at me because it thinks I'm blind. I finally have orca disabled and the computer is useful. The delays are a pain in the a$$ but i can do work now. It is not useful when orca is using 90% of a 6 core I5 yelling at me loud enough to announce and pronounce every keystroke or mouse motion/click loud enough to wake the neighbors.  The first 23 installs never asked me if I wanted that crap. And if you nuked the orca executable it would not reboot but hung forever waiting for orca to start. I have it usable, the installer AFAIAC is broken and I don't want to have to go through all that again. Until the installer ASKS me if I want it because it thinks I am blind, I have only one nerve left and and the suggestion that I do yet another install, is standing on it. Trying to remove it now, it insists on removing gnome and every dependency. I just checked again with synaptic, removing either orca or brltty still wants to destroy the system, Yet all I get when I fuss about the broken installer is "won't fix, not broken'.

Hi Gene,

I, too, am not in need of the services that  brltty or orca provide, and have 
noticed them hanging about from time to time, although I have not encountered 
any difficulties like you describe.

On a bullseye system, apt-rdepends -r brltty informs me:

# apt-rdepends -r brltty
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree... Done
Reading state information... Done
brltty
  Reverse Depends: brltty-espeak (= 6.3+dfsg-1+deb11u1)
  Reverse Depends: brltty-flite (= 6.3+dfsg-1+deb11u1)
  Reverse Depends: brltty-speechd (= 6.3+dfsg-1+deb11u1)
  Reverse Depends: brltty-x11 (= 6.3+dfsg-1+deb11u1)
brltty-espeak
brltty-flite
brltty-speechd
brltty-x11

If I understand apt-rdepends correctly, you should be able to remove/purge brltty 
("apt purge brltty") without removing any installed packages other than the 
four listed above.

apt-rdepends -r orca tells me:

# apt-rdepends -r orca
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree... Done
Reading state information... Done
orca
  Reverse Depends: gnome (>= 1:3.38+3)
  Reverse Depends: gnome-orca (3.38.2-2)
  Reverse Depends: orca-sops (1.0.2-2)
gnome
gnome-orca
orca-sops

So removing orca would also take gnome, and that probably is unacceptable to 
you. Accordingly, you need to tame orca to find the process that causes it to 
run and persuade it not to do that.

I found, on a bookworm install (I have no bullseye with gnome and orca), that running orca -s from a terminal 
will bring up a settings panel with a check box for "Enable speech" under the "Speech" 
tab. Unchecking that box and selecting the "Apply" button will silence Orca. I think that leaves 
some of its subtasks running, as children of the systemd --user task; I am far from expert here. They do not 
seem to use significant resources, however.

Alternatively, you can find orca's process, for instance, with "ps -ef | grep 
orca", and kill it. The -HUP signal is enough. Or you can kill its parent process 
(third column in the ps -ef output) if it is not a necessary one, or maybe teach it how 
to not start orca in the first place,

I hope this is useful. Things like this can be very annoying.


Regards,
Tom Dial


.

Cheers, Gene Heskett, CET.

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