I find the Mac fonts to be easier to read than Windows and more so than those used on any X11 system.
On my openSUSE 11.0 machine, size 10 Sans for Desktop/Document/Application, Sans Bold for Window title, and Monospace for fixed is at least usable. James -----Original Message----- From: Frank Ludolph <[email protected]> To: Ginn Chen <Ginn.Chen at Sun.COM> Cc: Jedy Wang <Jedy.Wang at Sun.COM>, Desktop Discuss <desktop-discuss at opensolaris.org>, Calum Benson <Calum.Benson at Sun.COM>, Indiana Discuss Mailing List <indiana-discuss at opensolaris.org> Subject: Re: [desktop-discuss] [indiana-discuss] 2008.11 UI Spec Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 10:03:29 -0700 After a little further investigation I will agree with the change Ginn suggests. When I set the default size to 16 in both Windows and OpenSolaris they appeared to render the same pages at about the same size. I believe that when I orginially did the evaluation I had changed the default minimum size in my Windows Firefox and so the comparison was invalid. I was, in fact, indirectly trying to address Ginn's concern about rendering. I am using Windows and, to a lesser extent, Mac as visual guidelines to determine the default font settings for OpenSolaris. The reason for this is that many users will use OpenSolaris within Virtual Box on those systems and it is more comfortable for users if fonts and icons appear to be closely matched in size when switching between the two. It will also seem more "correct" for users who use multiple computers with a variety of systems. For those who may be wondering, I did check that both systems were set for rendering at the same pixel resolutions, both dpi and overall screen resolution. Many LCD/laptop users whose systems are set to 96dpi may find the font sizes a bit small (both Windows and OpenSolaris) due to the higher dpi of laptop and some LCD displays. They might want to adjust the dpi to about 120. So Calum, can we adjust the UI Guidelines for FireFox default to 16pt? Thanks everyone, Frank Ginn Chen wrote: > Hi Frank, > > > In OpenSolaris 2008.11 UI spec, it defines Firefox default font as > "Deja Vu Serif: 14pt". > I don't think we should do that. > Because IE, Safari, Firefox all use 16pt as default, so web developers > would test their pages with this setting. > If we use a smaller font, it may break the layout of some pages. > Yes, it's the fault of the web developers, they should specify the > font size to make sure it won't happen. > But the reality is not all the web developers would test their pages > with different settings. > So I think we'd better keep align with others. > > > Thanks, > > > Ginn > > > On Aug 12, 2008, at 4:00 PM, Frank Ludolph wrote: > > > Hi Jedy, > > > > I'll reply since I was the one that suggested the sizes... > > > > Be sure to distinguish the system font sizes (8 pt) from the font > > sizes for Thunderbird and Firefox. The latter are larger. What are > > you using to read emails. > > > > I agree that the sizes sound quite small, but the default GNOME > > default fonts look very, very large compared to the defaults on > > Windows and Mac. The sizes shown in the UI spec provide > > approximately the same appearance as those desktops. To arrive at > > them I ran 2008.05 under virtualbox on Windows XP in an alternate > > workspace and switched between Windows and OpenSolaris workspaces. > > To test the system fonts I used preferences panels, menus, file > > manager windows, etc. As a cross check I set the same sizes on a > > bare metal install on a laptop. > > > > This applies of course to roman character sets. Asian fonts may > > require something else? > > > > The same techniques were used to set the icon sizes. > > > > BTW, my eyesight is now quite poor. I find the suggested sizes to be > > legible though occasionally a size too small for my old eyes. > > > > Frank > > > > > > Jedy Wang wrote: > > > Hi Calum, > > > > > > Are you really sure that default font size for GNOME is 8 pt? This size > > > is really small and make it very hard to read mails. > > > > > > Developers of firefox also think 14/12 is too small for the browser. And > > > according to their feedback, most browsers use 16. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Jedy > > > On Fri, 2008-08-08 at 17:41 +0100, Calum Benson wrote: > > > > > > > Since we didn't quite get around to implementing the UI spec for > > > > 2008.05, we've recently been tweaking it a bit for 2008.11 (and have > > > > actually assigned people to make it happen this time...) > > > > > > > > <http://opensolaris.org/os/community/desktop/uispecs/indiana-uispec/> > > > > > > > > Comments welcome... it hasn't really changed too much since what we'd > > > > planned for 2008.05, bar a bit more panel reshuffling (to try and > > > > achieve a functional split of "actions and status" on top and "windows > > > > and workspaces" on the bottom), and some minor changes to accommodate > > > > upstream changes in GNOME 2.24. > > > > > > > > Cheeri, > > > > Calum. > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > desktop-discuss mailing list > > > desktop-discuss at opensolaris.org > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > indiana-discuss mailing list > > indiana-discuss at opensolaris.org > > http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/indiana-discuss > > -------- > Ginn Chen > Software Engineer, Browser Team > Sun Microsystems, Inc. > Phone: x82869 / +86-10-62673869 > Fax: +86-10-62780969 > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > > _______________________________________________ > indiana-discuss mailing list > indiana-discuss at opensolaris.org > http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/indiana-discuss > _______________________________________________ desktop-discuss mailing list desktop-discuss at opensolaris.org
