I pinned a message to #beam reminding people of the user@, but pinned messages aren't immediately visible. We might be better off editing the topic, which always appears at the top of the channel, to include https://beam.apache.org/community/contact-us/ or links to user@ and SO. We should also add the same topic to the #beam-java and #beam-python channels, which currently don't have any topic.
Kyle Weaver | Software Engineer | github.com/ibzib | kcwea...@google.com On Mon, Sep 9, 2019 at 9:06 AM Pablo Estrada <pabl...@google.com> wrote: > +Ismaël Mejía <ieme...@gmail.com> can you share your impressions from > Slack? Do you think Java/Python/other users get appropriate support there? > > On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 7:16 PM Ahmet Altay <al...@google.com> wrote: > >> I agree Slack can be used by Beam users and it would be good to meet >> users where they are. If I understand correctly, the issue Pablo is raising >> is that there are not enough people online in Slack that can answer python >> questions. We also need to help people who ask questions and who can answer >> them find a common platform. Perhaps simply adding a subject in Slack chat >> rooms suggesting SO as an alternative question asking platform might >> improve the situation. >> >> On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 5:45 PM Austin Bennett < >> whatwouldausti...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> I see no reason slack can't be suitable for Beam users -- other open >>> source projects do utilize Slack for user chatter, too. Though what it >>> could be is different from how currently used. There are 173 accounts in >>> #beam-python, and a decent portion of recent conversations (at quick >>> glance) look like they are users asking for advice (which maybe should be >>> pointed to the Google Cloud Slack account...) >>> >>> I suggest meet users wherever they are (don't abandon slack), but that >>> is from a community standpoint. If people are metrics focused, that might >>> be harder in slack and/or we can find ways to measure things for those that >>> have benchmarks to hit. I am willing to dig into Slack's API if desired, >>> to surface/forward messages as useful. Not sure how all that would look, >>> open to figure it out. >>> >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 4:47 PM Ahmet Altay <al...@google.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Both StackOverflow and mailing lists have better answer rates for >>>> python questions. Suggesting either one of them makes sense. I also find >>>> StackOverflow easier to use but that is a personal preference. The >>>> original problem is that lack of support within Slack. Both mailing list >>>> and stackoverflow are already listed in the support page above Slack. How >>>> are we going to redirect these folks from Slack to SO or ML? >>>> >>>> Also, what is the profile of people on slack in general. I had the >>>> impression that it is more tuned for developer working on Beam to interact >>>> rather than for users to ask Beam questions. Is this accurate? >>>> >>>> Ahmet >>>> >>>> On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 4:41 PM Kenneth Knowles <k...@apache.org> wrote: >>>> >>>>> +1 to StackOverflow first, though I'm not important for Beam Python >>>>> users. Udi has a good point about discussions. If an SO question has a lot >>>>> of back and forth, or no response, then it is good to point to other >>>>> channels the user might try next. >>>>> >>>>> Kenn >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 2:20 PM Robert Bradshaw <rober...@google.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I would also suggest SO as the best alternative, especially due to its >>>>>> indexability and searchability. If discussion is needed, the users >>>>>> list (my preference) or slack can be good options, and ideally the >>>>>> resolution is brought back to SO. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 1:10 PM Udi Meiri <eh...@google.com> wrote: >>>>>> > >>>>>> > I don't go on Slack, but I will be notified of mentions. It has the >>>>>> advantage of being an informal space. >>>>>> > SO can feel just as intimidating as the mailing list IMO. Unlike >>>>>> the others, it doesn't lend itself very well to discussions (you can only >>>>>> post comments or answers). >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 10:55 AM Pablo Estrada <pabl...@google.com> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> Hello all, >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> THE SITUATION: >>>>>> >> It was brought to my attention recently that Python users in Slack >>>>>> are not getting much support, because most of the Beam >>>>>> Python-knowledgeable >>>>>> people are not on Slack. Unfortunately, in the Beam site, we do refer >>>>>> people to Slack for assistance[1]. >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> Java users do receive reasonable support, because there are enough >>>>>> Beam Java-knowledgeable people online, and willing to answer. >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> On the other hand, at Google we do have a number of people who are >>>>>> responsible to answer questions on StackOverflow[2], and we do our best >>>>>> to >>>>>> answer promptly. I think we do a reasonable job overall. >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> SO LET'S DISCUSS: >>>>>> >> How should we advise the community to ask questions about Beam? >>>>>> >> - Perhaps we should encourage people to try the mailing list first >>>>>> >> - Perhaps we should encourage people to try StackOverflow first >>>>>> >> - Perhaps we should write a bot that encourages Python users to go >>>>>> to StackOverflow >>>>>> >> - something else? >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> My personal opinion is that a mailing list is not great: It's >>>>>> intimidating, it does not provide great indexing or searchability. >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> WHAT I PROPOSE: >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> I think explicitly encouraging everyone to go to StackOverflow >>>>>> first will be the best alternative: It's indexed, searchable, less >>>>>> intimidating than the mailing list. We can add that they can try Slack as >>>>>> well - without any guarantees. >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> What do others think? >>>>>> >> -P. >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> [1] https://beam.apache.org/community/contact-us/ >>>>>> >> [2] >>>>>> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/apache-beam?tab=Newest >>>>>> >>>>>
