Katia, Kevin is interested and part of the D&I effort, and also an expert in opt-in and unsolicited email. I very much suggest you consult with him before sending emails to vast groups of people who haven't asked for D&I emails.
Cheers, -g On Thu, Oct 24, 2019 at 3:26 AM Katia Rojas <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi Sally, > > Sorry about that. > > We would like to share this survey with contributors involved with the > ASF. Where contributors is something bigger than committers, could included > non committers. > > The main purpose of this survey is to gather feedback from > existing ASF contributors about the current level of diversity and > inclusion, including education, age, socio-economic status, and gender. > > Which mailing list would be appropriate? > Thanks > > > > > > On Thu, 24 Oct 2019 at 03:08, Sally Khudairi <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Thank you, Katia. >> >> I've seen you trying to send multiple emails to committers@ along with >> whatever is being disseminated to the [email protected] list. >> >> This is improper use of the committers@ email --this list is restricted >> to very specific types of messages. We cannot be copying 7,000+ recipients >> on every conversational message or project update. This why none of your >> messages have been moderated through. >> >> Please let me know specifically what you're looking for (what is your >> intended outcome) so we can sort out the best way to proceed with a >> tactical plan. >> >> Kind regards, >> Sally >> >> - - - >> Vice President Marketing & Publicity >> Vice President Sponsor Relations >> The Apache Software Foundation >> >> Tel +1 617 921 8656 | [email protected] >> >> >> On Wed, Oct 23, 2019, at 20:40, Katia Rojas wrote: >> > Good point. >> > >> > I ping press@. Sally, could you help us? >> > >> > Thanks, >> > >> > >> > >> > On Thu, 24 Oct 2019 at 02:06, Niclas Hedhman <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> Sally would probably be very helpful to reach a wider group. She has >> direct >> >> lines with media and it is likely that some/many of these would assist >> in >> >> getting the message out. Could perhaps also contact StackOverflow >> (others?) >> >> and see if they would be interested to help out with maybe a small >> >> paragraph in their newsletter. >> >> >> >> On Wed, Oct 23, 2019 at 11:52 PM Katia Rojas <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >> >> > Thanks, Shane. >> >> > >> >> > And what about sending it to: >> >> > [email protected] and >> >> > [email protected] >> >> > As the *effective* group of people we can contact with hopes of >> responses? >> >> > >> >> > Would be acceptable to define “contributor” in this survey as people >> >> > involved with the ASF and that we could reach them out by the mailing >> >> > lists? >> >> > How could we justify being more inclusive but at the same time >> effective >> >> > because sending postal cards or phone calls or any other channel >> different >> >> > from email is not viable. Is it possible to justify or not? >> >> > >> >> > I understand that “all” is a big term and might be impossible to be >> done if >> >> > we are strict with the terminology and what it implies so my >> question would >> >> > be is it possible or desirable to focus on committers and a sector >> of non >> >> > committers (don’t know how small or big it would be dev@) to get an >> >> > initial >> >> > idea of the barriers they are encountering while trying to join us? >> >> > >> >> > I can see both points of view. I am not 100 percent sure if it is >> better >> >> > this way or the other. From my perspective, only committers is >> limited but >> >> > I struggle justifying or defining the definition of “contributors” >> that we >> >> > are using here and that it doesn’t have to be necessarily a >> definition to >> >> > be used in other projects. I think there is space to define this >> term but I >> >> > wouldn’t like to be arbitrary and exclude people because it is not >> possible >> >> > to contact them. >> >> > >> >> > Thanks, >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > On Wed, 23 Oct 2019 at 16:46, Shane Curcuru <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> > >> >> > > Katia Rojas wrote on 2019-10-23 3:22PM GMT+2: >> >> > > ...snip... >> >> > > > Where should we send the survey that we've been working on? >> >> > > > >> >> > > > So far there is a strong opinion on sending it only to the >> >> > > > [email protected] <[email protected]> >> >> > > > >> >> > > > The main purpose of this survey is to gather feedback from all >> existing >> >> > > ASF >> >> > > > contributors about the current level of diversity and inclusion, >> >> > > including >> >> > > > education, age, socio-economic status, and gender. >> >> > > ...snip... >> >> > > "All existing ASF contributors" is tens of thousands of people, >> many of >> >> > > whom we may not have any effective way to contact (i.e. drive-by >> >> > > contributors to various Apache projects in the past). So defining >> >> > > "contributor" is important; it's also important to decide what >> >> > > *effective* group of people we can contact with hopes of responses. >> >> > > >> >> > > dev@diversity will only get a very small number of highly >> self-selected >> >> > > individuals, so is no where near what we need. >> >> > > >> >> > > It seems to me (and I'm not on the survey team), the best thing to >> do is >> >> > > mirror the existing 2016 survey and send a single, well-written >> email to >> >> > > [email protected] asking all Apache committers to respond. >> While >> >> > > that won't catch non-committers who have contributed, it's a very >> >> > > important metric to start with, and is much easier than trying to >> >> > > contact all-dev@ lists or use the giant announce@ list. >> >> > > >> >> > > I understand the goal; but the effort and effectiveness for >> reaching >> >> > > *all* contributors is much higher. It feels like getting a really >> solid >> >> > > set of committer data first might be best. >> >> > > >> >> > > Does that make sense? >> >> > > >> >> > > Note also that there are specific technical rules for successfully >> >> > > emailing committers@ or other wide lists, so be sure to work with >> infra >> >> > > or someone to get help before physically sending the mail. >> >> > > >> >> > > -- >> >> > > >> >> > > - Shane >> >> > > Director & Member >> >> > > The Apache Software Foundation >> >> > > >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Niclas Hedhman, Software Developer >> >> http://polygene.apache.org - New Energy for Java >> >
