On 29 Sep 07, at 1:30 PM 29 Sep 07, Wendy Smoak wrote:
On 9/29/07, Jason van Zyl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
As the first alpha I don't really care. I just changed a bunch of
things and I will continue to change it. If you don't trust the
release plugin then I will stage one but it what is in trunk.
If for alphas people want it to be staged I can do that, but I'm
going to pop them out one after another until the issues all get
cleared up.
It has nothing to do with whether I trust the release plugin. We need
to be voting on the actual bits to be released, not on the general
state of the code in svn.
Why, and says who? These things are not cast in stone and we have the
ability to adapt the process to make it more productive.
I will publish it, no one will actually try it and the problems will
just be found when it's released in the wild. The bits are put there
and historically the only person who has found anything is the Kulper
but that wasn't from actually trying the plugin it was looking at the
contents. If the release plugin produces something legally intact and
it's an alpha it's probably better to look at the code don't you think?
I don't really care. Staging a release is not a big deal, just
invariably pointless for an alpha because 99% of the time no one will
actually do anything with the staged copy. It's more important that
the stuff gets cranked out for feedback so it can be fixed. I mean
even with releases hardly anyone looks. It's nice idea in theory but
if it serves no practical purpose what is the point. I was hopeful
that the staged copy would illicit feedback but doesn't seem to have.
Not much anyway.
I only say this because I see very little, if any feed back on
release plugins, and even released versions of Maven. The best
feedback I get is from plugins that I just crank out from Mojo and I
get two or three people providing feedback and that really helps. I
mean even staging it sometimes doesn't help if you look at the last
release of Archetype. Releases must be scrutinized (even though they
aren't) but let the alphas sail out fast and furious for feedback. We
don't intermediary releases out fast enough because it still must be
a pain in the ass for people which means only the determined will
build from source which means we miss out on the vast majority of
potential feedback. People should lock down there plugin versions
(the enforcer plugin on the next release will help with that, and
they should turn off any automagic update policy) so that we can
release this stuff often and people can try it as they like.
We either adapt or people will continue annoy our users. People don't
release often because something is wrong in our process. It is still
deemed cumbersome because we still have the same pool of people doing
releases and not many new people. Three +1 votes should really mean
trying the software and actually reviewing code but we know that no
one does that so what is difference really between pointing at a
revision or trunk or putting some binaries somewhere?
--
Wendy
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Thanks,
Jason
----------------------------------------------------------
Jason van Zyl
Founder, Apache Maven
jason at sonatype dot com
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