The issue has been resolved, so yes - I am trying to get you to shut up
about it.
If you spent half as much time creating a configuration patch as you did
making your silly pointless arguments, then your customers and sysadmins
would have the log configurations they need.
Adrian Crum
Sandglass Software
www.sandglass-software.com
On 9/15/2014 1:17 PM, Pierre Smits wrote:
I am not debating your point that configuring log settings is a standard
practice. I am debating the mimimum that OFBiz provides OOTB and whether
that is good enough for the majority of the users.
I use OFBiz in my business. I offer it as a business solution to my
prospective customers, and I provide services around around OFBiz.
So yes, I have a vested interest in having a solution that is easily
implemented, including ease of reporting on functioning in any kind of
operation setting. An OOTB error.log helps with that. Having someone to go
into an extensive log file and extract from there the errors and report
those is eating up more time than having the report ready. Likewise is
having to configure every new instantiation to get it to the default that
is needed in a business environment (and according to business needs).
Having a feature set and a configuration setting that satisfies the
majority is better than having one that satisfies a minority.
That you hold my argument as just for the sake of argumentative, is beside
the reality I am faced with. A reality that others might have as well. It
seems to me that your last remark is rather intended to have me (and
others) shut up about this than trying to resolve this issue.
Pierre Smits
*ORRTIZ.COM <http://www.orrtiz.com>*
Services & Solutions for Cloud-
Based Manufacturing, Professional
Services and Retail & Trade
http://www.orrtiz.com
On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 1:52 PM, Adrian Crum <
adrian.c...@sandglass-software.com> wrote:
I agree the importance is in the arguments.
You have argued that *forcing* someone to configure their log settings in
a production deployment places an undue burden on them. As I have pointed
out, configuring log settings is standard practice - no one is being forced
to do it. In fact, only a fool would run OFBiz in a production environment
using the OOTB settings.
So, your argument has been contrived simply for the sake of being
argumentative. Clearly, your participation in this discussion is not in the
best interest of the community.
Adrian Crum
Sandglass Software
www.sandglass-software.com
On 9/15/2014 12:35 PM, Pierre Smits wrote:
The timing of when an opinion is expressed in a posting should be
considered of a lesser importance than the arguments in such postings.
Given that your viewpoint only supports your personal case, makes me
wonder
whether you have the best interest of other community members and users at
heart.
Pierre Smits
*ORRTIZ.COM <http://www.orrtiz.com>*
Services & Solutions for Cloud-
Based Manufacturing, Professional
Services and Retail & Trade
http://www.orrtiz.com
On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 12:28 PM, Pierre Smits <pierre.sm...@gmail.com>
wrote:
Having an error.log OOTB, for sure, doens't have a negative impact on
you.
Pierre Smits
*ORRTIZ.COM <http://www.orrtiz.com>*
Services & Solutions for Cloud-
Based Manufacturing, Professional
Services and Retail & Trade
http://www.orrtiz.com
On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 12:19 PM, Scott Gray <scott.g...@hotwaxmedia.com
wrote:
Everyone? So far we only have Jacques. Well and you I guess, but
that's
debatable considering you only just decided yesterday to form a strong
opinion so I have my doubts about it having a negative impact for you.
Regards
Scott
On 15/09/2014, at 10:14 pm, Pierre Smits <pierre.sm...@gmail.com>
wrote:
Why *force* EVERYONE not to have an error log OOTB? Why *force*
EVERYONE to
spend time and money to get it back in?
Pierre Smits
*ORRTIZ.COM <http://www.orrtiz.com>*
Services & Solutions for Cloud-
Based Manufacturing, Professional
Services and Retail & Trade
http://www.orrtiz.com
On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 12:09 PM, Adrian Crum <
adrian.c...@sandglass-software.com> wrote:
Jacques,
That perspective goes both ways. From my perspective, you are trying
*force* everyone to do things your way.
That is why everyone is trying to get you to realize that a
one-size-fits-all setting will not work - because everyone is
different.
If you want the error log on your installation, then configure it to
do
so. Why *force* EVERYONE to have an error log?
Adrian Crum
Sandglass Software
www.sandglass-software.com
On 9/15/2014 10:19 AM, Jacques Le Roux wrote:
Not when you want to quickly spot obvious errors that you can easily
fix
or wait to fix later, and yes I spent my share of debugging also...
But anyway, why do you want to *force* everybody to use the same way
than you, are you an OFBiz prophet?
Jacques
Le 15/09/2014 10:53, Scott Gray a écrit :
As someone who has spent thousands of hours debugging OFBiz
installations I can assure you that the error.log is redundant and
provides no true value over ofbiz.log. As I've mentioned a few
times
now, OFBiz errors are regularly worthless without knowledge of the
context of the error which can only be found in ofbiz.log.
With a few command line tools "clutter" is a total non-issue and
even
a basic knowledge of those tools is a total time saver when
investigating log files.
Regards
Scott
On 15/09/2014, at 7:43 pm, Pierre Smits <pierre.sm...@gmail.com>
wrote:
On the basis that log analysis and error identification/reporting
costs
money, and the more complex this process is the more it costs.
An error log contains less clutter and is the first point in
identification
and triage of (severe) issues in any organisation that has adopted
a
methodology for service delivery (e.g. ITIL, ISO/IEC 20000, etc),
specifically the error control process (in ITIL)
Without this OOTB more time is spend on:
- going through the other, more detailed log(s) in the various
OFBiz
systems an organisation might have (e.g. dev, test, prod, etc)
- getting the error log back and ensuring that it stays in.
Pierre Smits
*ORRTIZ.COM <http://www.orrtiz.com>*
Services & Solutions for Cloud-
Based Manufacturing, Professional
Services and Retail & Trade
http://www.orrtiz.com
On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 2:29 AM, Scott Gray <
scott.g...@hotwaxmedia.com
wrote:
On what basis?
Regards
Scott
On 12/09/2014, at 9:44 pm, Pierre Smits <pierre.sm...@gmail.com>
wrote:
I support reverting this regression.
Pierre Smits
*ORRTIZ.COM <http://www.orrtiz.com>*
Services & Solutions for Cloud-
Based Manufacturing, Professional
Services and Retail & Trade
http://www.orrtiz.com
On Fri, Sep 12, 2014 at 11:29 AM, Jacopo Cappellato <
jacopo.cappell...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sep 12, 2014, at 10:35 AM, Jacques Le Roux <
jacques.le.r...@les7arts.com> wrote:
I don't understand why you are so not open to put back the
error.log in
log4j2.xml
Because it is just one of 1 million possible ways to configure
logging:
it
is a specific one on not a generic one and so it is not better
than the
other 1 million possibilities; you have explained why you like
it but
me or
others could find similar arguments for the other millions ways;
since
no
one seconded you in your attempt to add the configuration back
this
confirms to me that this specific configuration is not better
than
other;
for this reason it should be left out of the trunk.
and qualify this as a mess and almost myself and idiot.
I didn't say this and the mail archive can demonstrate it; you
have been
trying to raise the tone of the conversation since the beginning
of this
thread (and you did the same in at least another thread
recently)
but I
will not start to fight with you.
Jacopo
