On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 11:19 AM, RGB ES <rgb.m...@gmail.com> wrote: > 2013/3/19 Rob Weir <robw...@apache.org> > >> On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 9:21 PM, Guenter Marxen >> <guenter.mar...@googlemail.com> wrote: >> > Hi, >> > >> > Am 18.03.2013 19:05, schrieb Dave Fisher: >> > >> >> There is no consensus here to eliminate or reset the votes. Some who are >> >> more in touch with users have stated that it would be harmful. I trust >> their >> >> judgement. >> > >> > >> > as a longtime "OpenOffice"-user (since StarWriter 2.0), I think that in >> this >> > case, Rob is wrong and resetting the votes would be something like an >> > offense to us, the "old" users, who wrote and commented issues or voted >> for >> > issues for many years. >> > >> > I mainly used Writer, writing long texts with many images and many >> > references (f.e. an SO-/OOo-manual, widely spread in the german speaking >> > universities) and in times before the turbulences around OOo I made bug >> and >> > enhancement issues and also voted for issues. >> > >> > Look f.e. at issue 5608 >> > (https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=5608). >> > >> > It was raised in 2002 and the latest comment is dated 2012. (I did not >> find >> > "my votes" and the number of votes in bugzilla, but I think, I voted for >> it >> > in 2004.) >> > Although the issue is ten years old and nobody worked on it, it remains a >> > very important enhancement issue for all, who are writing long texts with >> > (many) references. The issue is not at all outdated! >> > >> >> I suppose it depends on how you define "important". Since issue 5608 >> was entered, back in 2002, we've fixed 36054 issues in Bugzilla. >> (31064 defects, 3839 enhancements and 1151 features). So that many >> bugs were fixed, or enhancements/features implemented, while issue >> #5608 was not. I don't know how you define "important", but to me >> something that is behind 36,054 other items is as close to unimportant >> as I can imagine. >> >> Remember, what things a developer chooses to code on is also a vote. >> They vote with their time. I count that kind of vote very highly, >> since it is backed up by actions. Those 36054 issues were important >> enough for someone to actually invest their time into fixing it. >> >> I don't mean to offend anyone by telling them that their issue is not >> important. We're all entitled to our personal preferences, and if you >> say something is important to you then I will gladly accept that. But >> from a project perspective, I think it is clear that an issue that was >> bypassed by 36054 other issues for over a decade, that an issue like >> this is certainly not a likely candidate for a"high priority" >> designation. The "votes" from project members, via their actions, has >> put 36054 other issues ahead of it. >> > > Rob, I think you are missing the point here. I agree that the choice of a > developer is a sort of "vote", and a really important one, but it is NOT > the same vote we are discussing here: votes on issues are cast by users, > not by developers. Votes are not a measure of feasibility but of hope: > there is a HUGE difference between saying "we are sorry, we don't have the > resources to implement this right now" and "because nobody implemented this > before, your issue is not that important for the community so we are > forgetting your votes". After all, those users that voted ARE an important > part of the community. > > I insist: "we cannot do that now" is not the same of "we will not do that > simply because nobody did it before". >
But this is not a case of "we don't have someone right now to work on it". It is not a case of "not today, but maybe next week". This is not a case of "Sorry, we can't fit it in this release, but maybe we'll do it in the next release." What this is is a case where no one, absolutely no one, zero, zip, nada, gar nichts, nobody has cared to deal with the issue in over a decade. That screams out UNIMPORTANT. Remember, there is such thing as false hope. And if ever there was an example of false hope it is someone hoping for a decade old issue in Bugzilla that has been passed by by thousands of other issues. -Rob > As Guenter said before, the fact that an old issue is still there does not > means that it is not important, it only means that it was not possible, for > whatever reason, to solve it. > > Regards > Ricardo > > > >> >> Regards, >> >> -Rob >> >> >> > The same is valid for issue 11901 >> > (https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=11901) and many others. >> > >> > I always have accepted, that the lack of ressources/developers prevents >> to >> > solve some/many issues "in time", but I could hardly accept, that "old" >> > stuff in bugzilla is reset/deleted and hence forgotten. I think, that >> some >> > old users ("issuers") would be frustrated. >> > >> > Instead of resetting the votes, one could have a list of 'issues with >> many >> > votes', "weight" them (f.e. as proposed by a survey) and then let the >> > volunteers/developers decide, if they want to work on their "most >> important" >> > issues in the list. >> > And perhaps for another ten years nobody is found to work on some or all >> of >> > them! But that does not change the importance of such issues (provided >> that >> > importance is not only measured by age). >> > >> > Special cases are concerns/issues by "users" like the city of Munich (as >> an >> > "beacon project", Leuchtturmprojekt), which can weight more than 1000 >> > individual votes. >> > >> > If the process is transparent, users and "issuers" will understand (and >> be >> > patient). >> > >> > -- >> > Grüße >> > >> > Günter Marxen >> > >> > >> > >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org >> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org >> > >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
