Hi Dmitry, I'm not a member of Tapestry team but here is my view as Apache committer.
On Thu, Jul 4, 2013 at 12:36 PM, Dmitry Gusev <dmitry.gu...@gmail.com>wrote: > Still my question remains: > > What do you expect from a person when you invite him as a committer to > Tapestry project? > Nothing. We just hope that (s)he will continue to help the best way (s)he can. A person gains the committer status for what (s)he has done before for the project. Not for promising that (s)he will do something in the future. This could be: helping other users, providing patches, writing docs/books, ... Apache is volunteer based organization so you cannot expect anything from anyone. By inviting a new member the team hope that (s)he will be still active and will help further with the development. But the new member can change her/his job soon after joining and then stop using the technology, so (s)he will not have a reason to do new development but still can help in the forums and in taking decisions about the future. > > I mean in each specific case. > > You just hope that he will do something useful someday with the core > codebase > or there is some concrete unit of work that you expect him to do? > > Or maybe that person asked to be committer and has some specific proposals > for contribution to the code base? > > > It is just unclear (to me) from the vote description what will the person > do (or what he plan to do) as a committer? > > This maybe unclear because we don't have any roadmap with pool of tasks > that should be implemented > except for a bunch of long-living JIRA issues. > > > > On Thu, Jul 4, 2013 at 10:05 AM, Kalle Korhonen > <kalle.o.korho...@gmail.com>wrote: > > > On Wed, Jul 3, 2013 at 5:56 PM, Howard Lewis Ship <hls...@gmail.com> > > wrote: > > > > > On Wed, Jul 3, 2013 at 2:06 PM, Dmitry Gusev <dmitry.gu...@gmail.com> > > > wrote: > > > > Dmitry Gusev: +1 (non-binding) > > > > I like seeing that new Tapestry committers appear, > > > > but looking at git logs I see that (almost) the only core committer > is > > > > Howard. > > > Well, I am the most invested in things. > > > > > > > There's a lot of people in any community who talk the talk but typically > > very few who walk the walk. I have a very high respect for Howard since > > most of the time he'll write the code instead of talking about some > changes > > he'd like to have. > > > > > > > > From this point of view, it appears to me that having Tapestry > > committer > > > > status means > > > > you can apply patches, but not develop new functionality in core, > > > > which I would expect from Tapestry committer when voting for him. > > > No the problem is committers who are not committing. Tapestry is > > > specifically designed so that it can support a wide number of > committers > > > with different skill sets: you don't have to be a bytecode wizard to > make > > > significant improvements to the code base. I know I'd appreciate the > > help! > > > > > > > Any committer can work anywhere in the codebase. In case of conflicts > we'll > > take a vote. But even if you tried, it's very hard to keep up with Howard > > with plain number of commits. You might be interested in fixing your pet > > peeve at some point but are you going to maintain interest in the project > > year over year and review other people's commits while working on your > > things? It's not that Howard is right all the time but by the time you've > > made your case on the list, he's already incorporated your feedback, > > refactored the code and added more tests. I've seen it happening multiple > > times. Most devs are pretty happy with the status quo, that somebody is > > doing the hard lifting for you or for them. > > > > > We can see that most of tapestry5 development now is third party > > > > development > > > > which occurs on GitHub and other separate repositories, resulting in > a > > > > tapestry-complement libraries, > > > > like tapestry5-jquery, tynamo, stitch, tapestry-bootstrap and many > > other > > > > wonderful projects. > > > > This is great, though, these projects stand aside from main tapestry > > > > development, > > > > and most of them appear outdated after new tapestry releases > > > > because they released separately from tapestry core. > > > > > > > I wouldn't say most but a successful project always creates a lively > > ecosystem around it. Keeping your stuff in a support library separate > from > > the core has its benefits as well as its drawbacks. A smaller, > independent > > library can evolve much faster but as each of them is implemented for a > > specific purpose, they'll typically drag behind and don't always support > > the latest and greatest core release. Also, the bar for bringing in your > > stuff to tapestry core is way higher than your typical run-of-the-mill > > github project. As a co-founder and author of multiple Tynamo libraries I > > can honestly say there's a reason why only one of the tynamo libraries > have > > "graduated" to tapestry core so far. > > > > > I'd really like to see more developers of those libraries as Tapestry > > > > committers so that they > > > > can support their own 3rd party libraries compatibilities as a part > of > > > main > > > > tapestry development, > > > > and may be hold tapestry core releases until all those libraries are > > > > up-to-date with new tapestry release. > > > > > > > > > > > For most libraries, that's just not the right path. Being in the core > > doesn't automatically mean they'd be somehow more supported. There needs > to > > be a general interest in a specific piece of code before it makes sense > to > > bring it to the core. If there's only one maintainer supporting the > > library, it is far easier to maintain it outside the core, without having > > to deal with the sheer size of the core, the unstability that other > changes > > cause, random test failures etc. The great thing about open source is > that > > in any given project, it's pretty easy to pick up the maintenance duties > > and start sending sending patches if you want a library you care about to > > be updated. Before you know it, you'll be the committer (and surprisingly > > often, the only maintainer as well), with others asking you to start > doing > > stuff for them. > > > > Kalle > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 3, 2013 at 11:43 PM, Kalle Korhonen > > > > <kalle.o.korho...@gmail.com>wrote: > > > > > > > > > Lance Semmens (aka Lance Java) has been one of the most active > > members > > > on > > > > > the user list for the past two years. I've personally committed a > few > > > > > patches from him and he is the maintainer of tapestry-stitch ( > > > > > https://github.com/uklance/tapestry-stitch/), a collection of > sample > > > > > components and concepts for Tapestry 5. Howard has spoke with him > > > > privately > > > > > and he's interested in joining as a committer. Vote to run for a > > > minimum > > > > of > > > > > three days. > > > > > > > > > > Kalle Korhonen: +1 (non-binding) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Dmitry Gusev > > > > > > > > AnjLab Team > > > > http://anjlab.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Howard M. Lewis Ship > > > > > > Creator of Apache Tapestry > > > > > > The source for Tapestry training, mentoring and support. Contact me to > > > learn how I can get you up and productive in Tapestry fast! > > > > > > (971) 678-5210 > > > http://howardlewisship.com > > > > > > > > > -- > Dmitry Gusev > > AnjLab Team > http://anjlab.com >
