Well, hope we get more thoughts here. W3C DDR is published, that's for sure, Maven after all is just a technical detail. And the URL under which W3C published it won't go away, so we need to find a a way to properly incorporate it. OR take the WURFL path of de-facto standard if we prefer to do this for 1.0.[?]
It's like Chicken and Egg, and nobody at W3C will bother making it available for Maven, next some project comes and requires it for Gradle, Ivy or other build systems[?] On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 8:44 PM, Reza <[email protected]> wrote: > I dont think its a good idea to have a dependency on a jar which isnt > publish and/or available to maven. That makes the project impossible to > use. Getting the old ODDR client working was a huge hassle and a high > barrier to entry. Im not saying no to the w3c standard, im just saying no > to an unpublished dependency. > > Sure, our jars havent been published yet, but once we release, thats the > plan... :) > > > ________________________________ > From: Werner Keil <[email protected]> > To: "[email protected]" < > [email protected]>; Reza <[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, July 8, 2014 2:35 PM > Subject: Re: Was contrib/w3c/ddr-simple contributed with permission? > > > They are, but they didn't give a sh* about Maven. It is avvailable under > http://www.w3.org/TR/DDR-Simple-API/DDRSimpleAPI.jar > That is the way W3C did it. > > I just completely eliminated the mirror, and if we still needed to use the > JAR, either a Maven build could access this GitHub repo > https://github.com/fnk/w3c-ddr > > Or we followed one of these (the 1st answer was used by OpenDDR so far, the > 2nd seems more practical if we don't get it into a "real" Maven form) > > http://stackoverflow.com/questions/4491199/build-maven-project-with-propriatery-libraries-included/4491343#4491343 > > > > > > On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 8:28 PM, Reza <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > ahh, ok, makes sense. So to implement the standard, the w3c artifact > needs > > to be published. > > > > Well, thats a pretty big blocker... > > > > > > ________________________________ > > From: Werner Keil <[email protected]> > > To: "[email protected]" < > > [email protected]>; Reza <[email protected]> > > Sent: Tuesday, July 8, 2014 2:25 PM > > Subject: Re: Was contrib/w3c/ddr-simple contributed with permission? > > > > > > It's a standard or "recommendation" just like HTML5 or CSS vX, so > > "rewriting it" would not be possible unless we declare it as "DeviceMap > > API" and put interfaces (instead of the current concrete classes, at > least > > it would make the API more abstract and possibly attractive to other > users) > > along the lines of the current Device, Pattern, Loader, etc. in a more > > prominent place. > > > > Some projects separate the API into a separate JAR or module, others, > most > > prominently Spring Framework usually don't bother doing so, thus you > > usually find the "API" and "impl" packages in the same JAR. > > > > I briefly tried to reach out to one or two people around the "Wurfl > > Converter" at "W3C" which took exactly an old, still Open Source version > of > > that WURFL.xml, (AFAIK the project also contains a copy of it there) and > > turns it into a W3C Compliant structure (similar to OpenDDR or DeviceMap > > now naturally) but nobody ever replied. Most people probably don't even > > work there any more, so nobody at W3C or the particular WG will do that > I'm > > afraid. > > > > For JAXB, DOM or CSS you'll find a few proper Maven artifacts by W3C, > > whether they were put there by a W3C project or just a desparate > downstream > > user, I can't tell. > > > > So unless we want to go down the path of "reinventing that standard/spec" > > inside DeviceMap, we have to find a way to get it there. Sonatype has a > > Deployment guide: > > http://central.sonatype.org/pages/ossrh-guide.html#deployment Maybe it's > > worth a try to raise an issue there, WDYT? > > > > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 8:01 PM, Reza <[email protected]> > > wrote: > > > > > Well, at Bertrand mentioned, that w3c api is not owned by this project. > > So > > > publishing that artifact is not a task for this project, rather, its a > > task > > > for anyone who can publish on behalf of w3c. > > > > > > Getting support for the Simple DDR standard is a task for this > project. I > > > havent looked at it too deeply, but I believe it might be possible > > without > > > the w3c jar being published, meaning, we write the API from scratch. I > > > could be wrong... so dont hold me to this. > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > From: Werner Keil <[email protected]> > > > To: "[email protected]" < > > > [email protected]>; Reza <[email protected]> > > > Sent: Tuesday, July 8, 2014 1:47 PM > > > Subject: Re: Was contrib/w3c/ddr-simple contributed with permission? > > > > > > > > > > > > There seems reason for both, and one (Mavenize it) would be > > > precondition/blocker for the other > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 7:44 PM, Reza <[email protected]> > > > wrote: > > > > > > I changed it to unassigned. I thought this task was exposing a w3c ddr > > api > > > in the client. Its still a task, I will make a new jira ticket to track > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > >________________________________ > > > > From: Werner Keil <[email protected]> > > > >To: "[email protected]" < > > > [email protected]> > > > >Sent: Tuesday, July 8, 2014 1:38 PM > > > >Subject: Re: Was contrib/w3c/ddr-simple contributed with permission? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Btw. it's also assigned to Reza at the moment, not sure, if he, > Bertrand > > > or someone else is the right person to find a place for the artifact, > but > > > there's already a JIRA ticket for this: > > > https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/DMAP-38 > > > > > > > > > > > >Werner Keil | JCP Executive Committee Member, JSR 363 Co Spec Lead | > > > Eclipse UOMo Lead, Babel Language Champion | Java Godfather > > > >Twitter @wernerkeil | @UnitAPI | @JSR354 | #EclipseUOMo | > #Java_Social | > > > #DevOps > > > >Skype werner.keil | Google+ gplus.to/wernerkeil > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >* Developer Week: 14/15 Jul 2014, Nürnberg, Germany. Werner Keil, JCP > EC > > > Member, JSR 363 Spec Lead, DevOps Guy will present "Triple-E' class > > > Continuous Delivery", "JSR 363 and IoT" (GER) > > > > > > > > > > > >* JavaZone 2014: 9-11 Sep 2014, Oslo, Norway. Werner Keil, JCP EC > > Member, > > > JSR 363 Spec Lead will present "JSR 363 - The Answer to Life Science > and > > > the Internet of Everything" > > > > > > > > > > > >* JavaOne 2014: Sep 28-Oct 2 2014, San Francisco, USA, Werner Keil, > JCP > > > EC Member, JSR 354 EG Member will host "Java and Digital Currencies, > > Friend > > > or FOE" > > > > > > > > > > > >* JMaghreb 3.0: 4-6 Nov 2014, Casablanca, Morocco. Werner Keil, JCP EC > > > Member, JSR 363 Spec Lead, DevOps Guy will present "Triple-E' class > > > DevOps", "JSR 363" > > > > > > > >* Mobile Developer Conference kompakt: 18 Nov 2014, Hamburg, Germany. > > > Werner Keil, JCP EC Member, Apache DeviceMap Committer will present > > "Apache > > > DeviceMap" (GER) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 7:23 PM, Werner Keil <[email protected]> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > >While there was an outage, the W3C pages related to DDR Simple seem up > > > again. > > > >>This page is very interesting: > > > http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/DDWG/drafts/api/test-report.html > > > >> > > > >> > > > >>It showed, what compatible implementations existed, and at least in > an > > > earlier version the most popular and likely commercially successful > > > (true;-) WURFL competitor DeviceAtlas did or still does implement it, > > too. > > > Passani's argument it is not used seems bullshit. If it became outdated > > and > > > e.g. DeviceAtlas no longer use those Java APIs, we could also question > > it. > > > Otherwise let's find a way to use it with Maven. > > > >> > > > >> > > > >>Werner > > > >> > > > >> > > > >>On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 6:47 PM, Werner Keil <[email protected]> > > > wrote: > > > >> > > > >>Weird, hopefully it's only a side-effect of Hurricane Arthur, but all > > of > > > W3C.org consistently seems DOWN right now, including the DDR API > standard > > > history. > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > >>>Another reason to not rely on e.g. the JAR the site also did provide > > > for historical reasons, but it seems better to find a BINARY distro > than > > > having to build it from a codebase like the one on GitHub (or > elsewhere, > > > not sure if W3C itself still has it, but AFAIK just like other > standards > > > like HTML5 you are free to use them without restriction or royalties) > > > > > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > >>>On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 6:02 PM, Werner Keil <[email protected]> > > > wrote: > > > >>> > > > >>>It is simply a clone of this: > > > >>>>https://github.com/fnk/w3c-ddr > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>>Essentially we would not need the source form in our SVN but the > real > > > key problem is, whether or not a BINARY Maven artifact can be provided > > in a > > > proper way? > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>>So far nobody bothered putting it on MavenCentral. Unless there is > a > > > legal reason W3C would prohibit that, I guess they just didn't see > Java > > or > > > Maven as important. > > > >>>>So consider it a "mirror" of the Git repo. If the DeviceMap build > > > system was flexible enough to grab it from his GitHub repo, then we > could > > > delete the mirror. > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>>We must find a way to "Mavenize" the target binary, otherwise there > > is > > > no point in using the W3C Simple DDR and we might have to drop the DDR > > > features once and for all > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>>Werner > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>>On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 5:22 PM, Bertrand Delacretaz < > > > [email protected]> wrote: > > > >>>> > > > >>>>Hi (Werner mostly as you committed this), > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>>The code under [1] is apparently from W3C, did you have permission > > > >>>>>from whoever owns its copyright to contribute it to this project? > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>>I don't see any license information, and lots of author tags which > > > >>>>>might indicate ownership - or not. > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>>I don't see an urgent need to remove that from our repository, but > > we > > > >>>>>should find out whether you were actually allowed to copy it here > or > > > >>>>>not. > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>>-Bertrand > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>>[1] > > > > > > https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/devicemap/trunk/contrib/w3c/ddr-simple > > > >>>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>> > > > >> > > > > > >
