On Fri, Feb 16, 2001 at 01:49:10AM -0500, Peter Cavender <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> [..]
> You can to go to /etc/rc.d/rc7.d (??)
> and delete the symlinks that start the services. But if I recall, e-smith
> now has this "self-healing" cruft, and it will attempt to undo your
> changes.
The server and gateway is designed to work as specified which includes
ensuring that all configured services run as intended.
> But I gave up on getting 4.x to cooperate.
e-smith 4.1 allows all services to be controlled through the services database.
> SO NOW A LONG SUPPRESSED RANT to the e-smith developers:
>
> 1) Forget the non-standard run-level stuff! I missed the arguments on why
> runlevel 3 wa not good enough, but I still disagree!
Very simple. Packages put all sort of stuff in run level 3. We want to run
only the required parts. A new run level leaves the packages pristine and
allows us to choose which bits to run. A simple link into rc7.d will
allow other packages to work in the extra run level.
> 2) This "self-healing" crap is for the birds, excluding flightless
> antartic waterfoul. I custimize my setup, but the next time I go through
> the console setup and reboot, it re-up-gerfuckulates things again.
It does exactly what you asked it to do. The console puts things into a known
state. That's by design and exactly what sets e-smith apart from other
systems. We have removed the most dangerous part of system administration -
hand-hacking of configuration files.
> YES, i
> know I can spend god knows how long editing template files ad nauseum, but
> I think that a knowledgable user should not be hampered by the mentality
> that Dilbert's boss'es nephew may mangle the setup and it needs to be
> "healed". Remember, uncontrolled and automatic "healing" is what causes
> cancer.
You need to be a knowledgeable e-smith user. e-smith is based on RedHat
Linux, but it uses a sophisticated template and action system which
simplifies operations and maintenance for the target market.
> 3) Don't get me wrong...I have been an e-smith user and cheerleader for
> over 2 years, and I use it at home and at work (3.1)....what seduced me
> was the 20 minute install and 3 minute configure.
What you value is all done by what you are ranting against.
> As I learned more Linux stuff, I decided to make
> modifications to the base setup....with each release it has become more
> and more difficult to make tweaks without having it "healed", or learning
> the template scheme.
The complexity is there to ensure repeatable operation and simple configuration
for end users.
> 4) NO, I do not support the notion of dropping netatalk or samba.
But some people do (for netatalk at least). You can now disable either/both,
which is the best of both worlds.
> 5) I DO support the notion of forking e-smith, or at least providing
> various levels of sysadmin "compentence" in a setup.
The more registered, paying customers we get, the more funds we have to develop
different or customised versions.
> 6) Maybe I don't like the whole ibay scheme: I work at a small company,
> and the big feat I accomplished with e-smith early on was having one
> "directory" that could be accesssed by SMB (Windows) users, Mac users,
> FTP, HTTP, and telnet for people running DOS but with FTP Software's
> client packages. Plus I added NFS for the local network so _everybody_
> could get to _everything_.
You seem to have argued that i-bays are exactly what you needed.
> (OK, flame me about NFS, but I have it set up
> to only accept on 192.*, and as I see it, only if someone at our ISP turns
> evil will we have a problem). But I am waiting for CODA or the next best
> thing to crush NFS.
We use NFS internally. We would also like to see a decent network file system
as NFS's "security" model is just not sufficient. See www.e-smith.org/faq.php3
> 7) MY proposals for forks:
> a) router/gateway only, ala LRP with sex appeal
e-smith 4.1 can be configured as such.
> b) above, with qmail and apache
e-smith 4.1 can be configured as such.
> c) above, with every e-smith feature, easily configured by
> non-stoopid people
e-smith 4.1 has exactly this.
> d) above, in heal mode, ala version 4.x
Every e-smith version will set the system to the state which you ask. That
includes building/repairing links, expanding templates, restarting daemons,
etc. If you don't want a service under e-smith 4.1:
/sbin/e-smith/db configuration setprop {servicename} status disabled
> It is because I love e-smith so much and have such respect for the people
> that have made it happen that I have spoken up. I have been much too
> busy with my *real* work to contribute too much to this list, but I hope I
> am heard.
> [...]
This is our *real* work. And we listen. And e-smith 4.1 can do all that you
ask in a regular, reproducible, maintainable way.
We look forward to your continued subscription to help fund further development.
Gordon
--
Gordon Rowell [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.e-smith.org (development) http://www.e-smith.com (corporate)
Phone: +1 (613) 564 8000 ext. 4378 Fax: +1 (613) 564 7739
e-smith, inc. 1500-150 Metcalfe St, Ottawa, ON K2P 1P1 Canada
