On 05/25/2016 08:49 PM, Ian Clarke wrote: > On Wed, May 25, 2016 at 6:44 PM, Arne Babenhauserheide <[email protected]> > wrote: >> >> Core technical reasons: >> >> - It excludes those of our users who assume (not unreasonably) that >> Google might de-anonymize them. >> > > Is there any technical evidence that Google Docs will deanonymize a Tor > user, or even an explanation of how this could occur? The Google Docs > client code can be easily examined, so if Google were somehow doing this, > wouldn't it be easy to see? > > In reality there is nothing other than your dislike of Google behind this > concern. You're welcome to dislike Google if you wish, but you will need > to make a better argument if you expect everyone else to adapt to your > personal view, which is what you seem to be asking for. > > >> - It also excludes those who do not run Tor but only use Freenet for >> anonymous communication. >> > > And how can such people anonymously use PiratePad, which is your preferred > choice? It has exactly the same issue. > > >> - It does not work without Javascript. Many of our users disable >> Javascript, especially on Tor. >> > > Same for PiratePad, which is the choice you have advocated. > > >> - People who follow the mailing list cannot follow the discussion and >> development of the document. This makes the work intransparent for >> most of our community. >> > > PiratePad also suffers from this problem, as would any practical solution > that met our needs. > > >> - It is a non-free platform, so this workflow could be cut at any time. >> > > In the extremely unlikely event that Google suddenly shuts down Google > Docs, then it will not be difficult to switch to another solution. > > These are all very weak arguments. > > >> Personal reason: >> >> When I told Ian about my reservations against using Google Docs, >> essentially the reasons I gave here, the discussion got personal. I >> won’t go into details here, but it hurt. > > >> If it had not been for that, I would have followed a community decision >> about Google Docs, just like I did about using Github. However this >> crossed the point of being about being reasonable. That’s why my >> decision not to use Google Docs here is final. >> > > So you admit that your position here is not governed by technical arguments > (a good thing, since those were not convincing), but rather by animosity > towards me due to a perceived insult. I'm glad you made that clear to > everyone. > > You have contributed very valuably to the project over the past few years > Arne, and I sincerely hope that you continue to do-so, there really is no > reason not to. > > But in this matter you aren't behaving constructively, and the project > should not accede to unreasonable demands which you've just admitted are > driven by personal animus towards me. > > The purpose of this project is to ensure that people have the freedom to > communicate without fear of reprisal or censorship. I don't see how any of > this serves that purpose.
I can understand if you're upset that Arne does not agree with you, but I don't understand what you're doing here. Do you expect that if you berate Arne he will come around? You are being disrespectful. I'm not at all suggesting that you aren't allowed to disagree, or be honest, but you seem to go about being honest by also being hurtful. It's possible to give feedback without making someone feel bad. I feel like you are approaching this with the goal of shutting down those who disagree with you, instead of collaborating and discussing with others to arrive at a reasonable solution to a problem.
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