Usually people playing devil's advocate argue the opposite side.. :P The way I see it, we're talking about giving up two rooms and a lot of usable/storage space for the equivalent of two members' dues.
Ron On 2012-10-04 09:56, Justin Lacko wrote: > If I could play devil's advocate... the only downside I see in this > plan is that we lose our planned computer room and arcade room, and > that equipment still kinda needs someplace to go. > > However: > 1. How many computers would we be setting up? > 2. We have lots of bench space in the workshop... we should set up a > few stations in there; namely a CAD/3D modeling station (I need to get > on this but am holding off until there's sufficient power) - maybe 4 > stations are enough? > > Is it possible that we further bisect the assembly room in the back > and make two rooms so that we can have a less-dusty room for arcades? > Colin makes a good point that we probably won't use the full length of > the assembly room. > > I think we should give the virtual reality machines back to Mike > Legary, because we really don't have the space to store them and right > now there's a lot required to get them going (is it worth it even?) > > ~Justin > > On 4 October 2012 09:22, Colin Stanners <cstann...@gmail.com> wrote: > > I'm quite for this; we have lots of space (I don't imagine use every > > using even half of the dirty workroom) and it'd be good to have all 3 > > organizations of the same type in the same place. > > > > Also keep in mind, 150/mo over the 3 years of our lease is ~$5k, which > > would pay for much of the electrical renos. > > > > > > On 10/3/12, Michael Kozakewich <mkozakew...@icosidodecahedron.com> wrote: > >> lol wut. We just use the light of the tesla coil to find our way at night. > >> > >> From: Michael Loney > >> Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 7:21 PM > >> To: discuss@lists.skullspace.ca > >> Subject: Re: [SkullSpace-Discuss] Ramp Up Manitoba and SkullSpace? > >> > >> Guys guys guys ... all is well and good until they plug in a night light. > >> > >> G Mike > >> > >> On Oct 3, 2012 7:19 PM, "Adrian Stoness" <tdk.kni...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> > >> the arcade could go in the back elevator room > >> > >> > >> On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 6:57 PM, Michael Kozakewich > >> <mkozakew...@icosidodecahedron.com> wrote: > >> > >> It’s $100/month for both those back rooms? > >> If we determine that we have enough space in other rooms, we could live > >> without that. One of the big complaints I’ve heard was that even though our > >> space is cheap, we have so much of it. > >> > >> We could free up space in the lounge by building (or getting) better > >> shelving. Most of the wall space against the back wall could hold stuff, > >> and > >> we could fit one of the more popular game machines. > >> When is the dirty work room going to be usable? (I see temporary > >> storage.) What does RampUp need in a space, anyway? (Maybe we could store a > >> couple things around them, if they just need table space and presenting > >> area.) > >> > >> From: Jay Smith > >> Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 6:13 PM > >> To: Justin Lacko > >> Cc: discuss@lists.skullspace.ca > >> Subject: Re: [SkullSpace-Discuss] Ramp Up Manitoba and SkullSpace? > >> > >> It's $2.045/sqft/year, so we would save $97.99/month on rent (not > >> including gst). > >> > >> And yes, we're no longer feeling very paranoid about hiding the rent > >> figures :P > >> > >> > >> On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 5:52 PM, Justin Lacko <jus...@takaji.ca> wrote: > >> > >> More around $2. But let's see if Jay can provide us with the numbers. > >> > >> > >> On 3 October 2012 17:41, Ron <r...@skullsecurity.net> wrote: > >> > We have roughy 4000 - 4500 sqft right now. 500 is between 20 and > >> 25% > >> of > >> > our rent. Our rent is what, $750/month, plus heat + possibly power, > >> so > >> > it'd be $200 - $400 / month, minimum. > >> > > >> > Also, tell them they have to clean the toilets. > >> > > >> > Ron > >> > > >> > On 2012-10-03 17:28, Mark Campbell wrote: > >> >> I think it was around $1/sq. ft.? > >> >> > >> >> On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 5:26 PM, Justin Lacko <jus...@takaji.ca> > >> wrote: > >> >> > >> >> > I don't know - Jay knows how many sq. ft. we're paying for > >> currently. > >> >> > > >> >> > On 3 October 2012 17:18, Mark Campbell <nitrod...@gmail.com> > >> wrote: > >> >> > > How much would skullspace save by giving up 575 square feet? > >> >> > > > >> >> > > On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 5:12 PM, Justin Lacko > >> <jus...@takaji.ca> > >> wrote: > >> >> > >> > >> >> > >> You guys are making this harder than it needs to be... no, we > >> won't > >> >> > >> try to make them SkSp members... why would Ramp Up want to > >> join us? > >> >> > >> > >> >> > >> Why would we look into building some kind of corridor that > >> will > >> >> > >> severely decrease our hallway space and just create more work > >> for us? > >> >> > >> > >> >> > >> Why would we look into administering the space and providing > >> power and > >> >> > >> finished rooms and then charge some kind of adjusted rent, > >> which would > >> >> > >> create a huge headache for us (and I would not be willing to > >> manage a > >> >> > >> space that we sublet, less I become a kind of defacto > >> landlord > >> myself > >> >> > >> >_>)? > >> >> > >> > >> >> > >> The easiest solution... and the one that requires almost no > >> investment > >> >> > >> from us and instant reward in the form of reduced rent... is > >> to wall > >> >> > >> off the entry from the lounge, or from the first room in the > >> set of > >> >> > >> two, and give the space to AW and adjust the amount of sq. > >> ft. > >> we pay > >> >> > >> for. > >> >> > >> > >> >> > >> To note: the two rooms make up 575 sq. ft. (taken from CAD > >> drawing). > >> >> > >> > >> >> > >> I think if we go looking to charge an adjusted rent for these > >> guys > >> >> > >> it'll just be a waste of our time and resources and put more > >> >> > >> management on our end. > >> >> > >> > >> >> > >> > >> >> > >> > >> >> > >> On 3 October 2012 16:49, Mark Campbell <nitrod...@gmail.com> > >> wrote: > >> >> > >> > This is a version of the electrical plan with the > >> dimensions > >> needed. > >> >> > >> > It's > >> >> > >> > approximately 500 square feet (31*16). > >> >> > >> > > >> >> > >> > On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 4:46 PM, Roswyne <rosw...@gmail.com> > >> wrote: > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> How big is the room? It may be more cost effective for > >> them just to > >> >> > >> >> buy > >> >> > >> >> SkSp memberships. > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> (i.e. if the room's 10'x10', 10 of them could get SkSp > >> memberships > >> >> > for > >> >> > >> >> the > >> >> > >> >> same price, and simply bring in other people as guests) > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> Alternately, if they're already affiliated with AW, > >> perhaps > >> they > >> >> > could > >> >> > >> >> just use the boardroom there? I don't think AW has any > >> particular > >> >> > use > >> >> > >> >> for > >> >> > >> >> another "office" type room. > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 4:42 PM, Mark Campbell > >> <nitrod...@gmail.com> > >> >> > >> >> wrote: > >> >> > >> >>> > >> >> > >> >>> Mike mentioned $4/square foot being the least expensive > >> option for > >> >> > >> >>> renting space in the exchange (not including the > >> maintenance, > >> >> > heating, > >> >> > >> >>> electricity). A figure around that (not sure what the > >> square footage > >> >> > >> >>> of the > >> >> > >> >>> room(s) are), if not a moderately less, would be > >> appropriate. > >> >> > >> >>> > >> >> > >> >>> > >> >> > >> >>> On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 4:37 PM, Justin Lacko > >> <jus...@takaji.ca> > >> >> > wrote: > >> >> > >> >>>> > >> >> > >> >>>> Negligible... I mean how much could we charge them in > >> reality? We'd > >> >> > >> >>>> have to provide electrical to the room, and finish it... > >> that's not > >> >> > >> >>>> thinking about renovations for access control (if we > >> deem > >> it > >> >> > >> >>>> necessary). It'd be much easier and save us more money > >> in > >> the long > >> >> > >> >>>> run > >> >> > >> >>>> IMO to just wall it off from our side either one or two > >> rooms, and > >> >> > >> >>>> then let AW build a door into it. > >> >> > >> >>>> > >> >> > >> >>>> On 3 October 2012 16:34, Mark Campbell > >> <nitrod...@gmail.com> > >> >> > wrote: > >> >> > >> >>>> > I think it's a worthwhile venture, yes. At least with > >> this > >> >> > >> >>>> > renovation, > >> >> > >> >>>> > there's a return on investment. > >> >> > >> >>>> > > >> >> > >> >>>> > On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 4:30 PM, Justin Lacko > >> <jus...@takaji.ca> > >> >> > >> >>>> > wrote: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > >> >> > >> >>>> >> Creating a hallway would make our lounge even smaller > >> and I'm > >> >> > sure > >> >> > >> >>>> >> we'd have to make it extra wide to follow any kind of > >> code - it > >> >> > >> >>>> >> would > >> >> > >> >>>> >> take a significant portion out of our space - and do > >> you really > >> >> > >> >>>> >> want > >> >> > >> >>>> >> to start even *more* renovations for SkSp?? > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > >> >> > >> >>>> >> On 3 October 2012 16:27, Mark Campbell > >> <nitrod...@gmail.com> > >> >> > >> >>>> >> wrote: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > That actually sounds like a great idea. It's a > >> perfect > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > opportunity > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > to > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > renovate the rooms in a nice way. Creating a > >> hallway > >> between > >> >> > the > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > main > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > hallway and the backroom shouldn't pose any problem > >> at that > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > point. > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 4:24 PM, Justin Lacko < > >> >> > jus...@takaji.ca> > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > wrote: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> Mark, > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> The savings would be the same... we'd pay less for > >> our lease > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> because > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> of less floor space. We'd also not need to worry > >> about > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> providing > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> them > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> with power. > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> If you wanna go the other way, we'd have to > >> >> > administrate/manage > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> the > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> rented space, provide power/finished walls/a > >> certain degree > >> >> > of > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> tenant > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> requirements, determine a price for power, as well > >> as debate > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> access > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> control since they'd be going through SkSp to get > >> to the > >> >> > rooms. > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> On 3 October 2012 16:19, Mark Campbell > >> <nitrod...@gmail.com> > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> wrote: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > Justin, from your mention of repartitioning the > >> space so > >> >> > that > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > AW > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > has > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > more, I > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > do not agree with this -- I was originally > >> thinking that we > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > could > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > make a > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > significant profit from leasing space to RU -- > >> that is, we > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > charge > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > them > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > more > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > $$ per square foot than we pay on our current > >> lease. > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 4:11 PM, Ron > >> <r...@skullsecurity.net > >> >> > > > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > wrote: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> Depending on what they need, they can just > >> become sksp > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> members > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> then > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> use > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> the space as they wish :) > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> Ron > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> On 2012-10-03 14:41, Justin Lacko wrote: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > Something that came up at yesterday's meeting > >> that I > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > believe > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > may > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > warrant further discussion: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > Does anybody like the idea of SkullSpace > >> renting out > >> >> > some > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > of > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > their > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > space to Ramp Up Manitoba? > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > This is a small group that recently merged > >> with > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > AssentWorks, > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > and > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > they > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > are looking for space. We could rent the two > >> back rooms > >> >> > to > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > them > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > and > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > help decrease our operating cost (which is > >> slated to go > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > up, > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > btw). > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > We > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > have a lot of space - it's just an idea. > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > Let's hear comments for/against! > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > > >> _______________________________________________ > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > Help: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > > >> >> > http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > Archive: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > > >> >> > https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> Help: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > >> >> > http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> Archive: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> >> > >> >> > https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________ > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > Help: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > > >> >> > http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > Archive: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > > >> >> > https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> _______________________________________________ > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> Help: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > >> http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> Archive: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> >> > >> https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > _______________________________________________ > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > Help: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > > >> http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > Archive: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > > >> https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ > >> >> > >> >>>> >> _______________________________________________ > >> >> > >> >>>> >> SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > >> >> > >> >>>> >> Help: > >> >> > http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > >> >> > >> >>>> >> Archive: > >> >> > >> >>>> >> > >> https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ > >> >> > >> >>>> > > >> >> > >> >>>> > > >> >> > >> >>>> > > >> >> > >> >>>> > _______________________________________________ > >> >> > >> >>>> > SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > >> >> > >> >>>> > Help: > >> >> > http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > >> >> > >> >>>> > Archive: > >> >> > >> >>>> > > >> https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ > >> >> > >> >>>> _______________________________________________ > >> >> > >> >>>> SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > >> >> > >> >>>> Help: > >> http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > >> >> > >> >>>> Archive: > >> >> > https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ > >> >> > >> >>> > >> >> > >> >>> > >> >> > >> >>> > >> >> > >> >>> _______________________________________________ > >> >> > >> >>> SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > >> >> > >> >>> Help: > >> http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > >> >> > >> >>> Archive: > >> >> > 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