Only Turkey is worse. Former Soviet Republics and countries with lower overall literacy score higher than us. I know we can do better than this. The fundamentalists are winning the hearts and minds of the American public= .
Acceptance of Evolution as fact: Evolution Less Accepted in U.S. Than Other Western Countries, Study Finds James Owen for National Geographic News <http://news.nationalgeographic.com/> August 10, 2006 http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2006/08/060810-evolution.html On 5/3/07, Kelly Decker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Thank you for your good work, David. > > I certainly agree that these journals have been around a long time. But > your contention that their impact is "nil" only pertains to the scientifi= c > field. I have heard parroted findings from the institute in Ohio, Arcata, > and Napa. They are issuing talking points, and they are having an effect. > > Would you now care to address the underlying concern wit hthe original > post? That we are not doing a good job of educating the public? > > A March 2007 Newsweek poll state that only 48% of americans believe that > Evolution is supported by scientific evidence and accepted by the > scientific community; 39% disagree; and 13% said they didn't know. > > That's kind of dismal, don't you think? > > Those people who do the damage get their ammunition and talking points > from > places like ICR. > > This is a real problem. It's an active disinformation campaign. > > I am not suggesting hysteria, just that people in science stop letting > misinformation pass by without being answered. (Not you personally, all > scientists) If more of us do that, there's less work. I write back and > forth with both Global Warming deniers and Evolution deniers in my local > paper. It's exhausting. > > K > > > > > At 08:54 AM 5/3/2007, David M. Lawrence wrote: > >Get to know me better before accusing me of being "blas=E9'" on the > subject. > >Read my posts, too. I haven't argued AGAINST more public outreach, and = I > >think my running (hosting) of the Virginia list in the AIBS/NCSE network > >shows that I do more than just "talk" about the problem. > > > >The topic was presented as if we are facing a crisis because of this > "new" > >"peer-reviewed" journal. I'm just pointing out a fact -- journals such > as > >this have been around a long time. Most of the public does not read > these > >journals, nor do they care to. The impact of this journal, like it's > >predecessor, and at least one similar journal still in existence, is nil= . > > > >More damage is done by people like a certain president who profess > "faith" > >in scientific concepts they really don't know anything about, by > political > >leaders (especially school board members) that exploit religion for > earthly > >power, and by poorly trained news media that parrot the most inane > nonsense > >under the guise of presenting "both" sides of an issue. > > > >If you want to get worked up, get worked up about real problems. This > >journal ain't one of them. > > > >I've been fighting this battle a long damn time -- since the equal-time > law > >was introduced in Louisiana in the 1980s. I think I've got a pretty goo= d > >handle on the issue, thank you. > > > >Dave > > > >------------------------------------------------------ > > David M. Lawrence | Home: (804) 559-9786 > > 7471 Brook Way Court | Fax: (804) 559-9787 > > Mechanicsville, VA 23111 | Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > USA | http: http://fuzzo.com > >------------------------------------------------------ > > > >"We have met the enemy and he is us." -- Pogo > > > >"No trespassing > > 4/17 of a haiku" -- Richard Brautigan > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: Kelly Decker [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > >Sent: Thursday, May 03, 2007 10:59 AM > >To: David M. Lawrence; ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU > >Subject: Re: Inaugural Call for Papers for the International Journal of > >Creation Research (IJCR). > > > >I am tossed between being confused and being happy by the heat of this > >discussion-hey....at least it makes things interesting. > > > >But I am confused by the blase' attitude of Dave. Dave, no one is saying > the > >world is coming to an end here....you are confusing Jim with the > >creationists on this point. Yes, there was a journal before, but let's > look > >at what has happened as as a consequence of creationism (and ID's) srtiv= e > >for scientific status. We had school boards across the country trying to > >weaken the high school science curriculum by adding labels to textbooks > and > >teaching creationism along the side of evolution as accepted theories. > >Think about the shortage of high school science teachers, will any of th= e > >spots be filled by graduates from this "program" in very religious > >districts? The only way this would not happen is with public eduation-so > the > >parents and board members will take exception it it. > > > >Jim's point is valid that we need more outreach to the public. What > >percentage of Americans 'believe' in evolution? My recollection is that > >percentage is woefully low. That is the underlying point here. If you > have > >ever heard Naomi Oreskes' talk about the history of GW denial, you will > >realize that the disinformation campaigns are powerful and effective. > After > >all, it is much easier and cheaper to refute the science of others than > to > >do one's own research. I am sure you have heard the same old > >"scientific-sounding" refutations of evolution over and over again. > >Whatever we are doing now, it isn't enough. I am glad that we had succes= s > in > >Dover, but we need more. > > > >Just my 2 cents. > > > >At 04:34 AM 5/3/2007, David M. Lawrence wrote: > > >Uh, Jim, do some research before you accuse others of being somnolent. > > >I happen to be the Virginia coordinator for the AIBS/NCSE Evolution > > >List Server Network > > >(http://www.aibs.org/mailing-lists/the_aibs-ncse_evolution_list_server= . > > >html) > > >. > > > > > >The ICR has done this before -- the old journal was just as > > >peer-reviewed as this one will be. The new journal, like the old one, > > >will be hailed by "true" believers, treated as a source of amusement > > >(along with Weekly World > > >News) by some, and ignored by most. > > > > > >Most people can do some math, and given that we have tree-ring, varve, > > >and glacial chronologies far older than the good Bishop Ussher > > >estimated the Earth to be, those people, upon reading the mission > > >statement of the journal, will be skeptical. > > > > > >As I remember -- only a few hours ago -- I didn't say that scientists > > >need not work to educate the public about the ways of science. What I > > >did say was that the ICR did this at least once before, 20-something > > >years ago, and the world DID NOT come to an end. > > > > > >Dave > > > > > >------------------------------------------------------ > > > David M. Lawrence | Home: (804) 559-9786 > > > 7471 Brook Way Court | Fax: (804) 559-9787 > > > Mechanicsville, VA 23111 | Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > USA | http: http://fuzzo.com <http://fuzzo.com= / > > > > >------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > >"We have met the enemy and he is us." -- Pogo > > > > > >"No trespassing > > > 4/17 of a haiku" -- Richard Brautigan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >________________________________ > > > > > >From: Jim Sparks [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >Sent: Thursday, May 03, 2007 7:22 AM > > >To: David M. Lawrence > > >Cc: ECOLOG-L@listserv.umd.edu > > >Subject: Re: Inaugural Call for Papers for the International Journal o= f > > >Creation Research (IJCR). > > > > > > > > >Okay the point is, this IS going to happen so, WHEN it is published it > > >is going to further confuse the public who already have a justifiably > > >shaky opinion of science due to the very anemic defense that scientist= s > > >themselves have offered in the past on this and other issues related t= o > >credibility. > > > > > >If you take the time to follow the link you will find that ICR is > > >fielding an entire graduate school for young earth creationism. > > >Students at that "school" will be trained thoroughy in a gigantic > > >bullshit story that perpetuates one of the most dangerous political > > >lies of our time, namely "Biblical innerrancy". Now any of you who > > >have ever deigned to read the Bibe should realize that it does not tur= n > > >out with a very happy ending for most of us. > > > > > >My contention is that "we" scientists will not mount much of a defense > > >here because "we" are so smarmy about science and our lovely ivory > > >tower, meanwhile the general public will go on saying things like > > >"Well, tests show that this drug X (which has a littany of fatalities) > > >was tested at at corporate sponsored university and it sure looks safe= " > > >or "Oh those crazy scientists never agree on global warming." Well, > > >now they can use this ICR journal to discount even basic evolution in > > >the increasingly under educated general public mind. > > > > > >Big Pharma: http://www.thenation.com/doc/20020805/newman20020725 > > >Big Oil: > > >http://www.ucsusa.org/news/press_release/ExxonMobil-GlobalWarming-toba= c > > >co.ht > > >ml > > > > > >Would one of you PhD's please get up off your keister and do something > > >about this, or at least consider it. There should be some resistance > to > >this. > > >This perpetutaes a paradigm that is not based on reality at all and it > > >will affect public opinion, if only by further undermining the > > >scientific method, regardless of the fact that none of us wil buy it. > > > > > >We are in many ways the intellectual vanguards of society and we > > >continue to shirk the responsibility we have to the public when money > > >or controversy are involved. > > > > > >I can't believe the two responses so far have accused me of > > >collaborating with creationists or entirely dismiss the idea that this > > >endeavor would undermine scientific methodology. Go ahead and rest on > > >your laurels but don't complain when even the more educated public > > >starts to get confused about the value of "peer review". > > > > > >Criminy! In the words of Spike Lee, "Wake up!" > > > > > >Sincerely, > > >Jim Sparks > > > > > > > > >On 5/2/07, David M. Lawrence <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > I doubt it will have much effect at all. ICR published a > > >similar journal in > > > the past. Now they'll have a new name and new volume numbers= , > > >but nothing > > > new to say. > > > > > > Dave > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > David M. Lawrence | Home: (804) 559-9786 > > > 7471 Brook Way Court | Fax: (804) 559-9787 > > > Mechanicsville, VA 23111 | Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > USA | http: http://fuzzo.com > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > "We have met the enemy and he is us." -- Pogo > > > > > > "No trespassing > > > 4/17 of a haiku" -- Richard Brautigan > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Ecological Society of America: grants, jobs, news > > > [mailto: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU > > ><mailto:ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU> ] On Behalf Of Jim Sparks > > > Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2007 10:48 PM > > > To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU > > > Subject: Inaugural Call for Papers for the International > > >Journal of Creation > > > Research (IJCR). > > > > > > Have you seen this? A peer reviewed journal for young earth > > >creationism! > > > Please tell me that someone out there is preparing some stiff > > >opposition to > > > this. > > > > > > When this thing gets off the ground it will do a pretty good > job > >of > > > undermining scientific method and credibility. This may be > > >even worse than > > > recent scandals involving pharmaceutical industry funding of > > > product research or petroleum industry scientists > contradicting > > > climatologists on global warming. Journals on the whole are > > >losing their > > > credibility because of various financial entanglements in a > few > >key > > > fields. This current attack is not going to help ecology and > > >evolutionary > > > biology one bit. > > > > > > As goes the reputation of journals, so goes the voices of > reason. > > >Can > > > anyone think of a way to defend Aristotelian logic or all we > > >all going to > > > just watch placidly as the age of reason slips into the > shadowy > > > recesses of a new, albeit perhaps more subtle Dark Ages. > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > Jim Sparks > > > http://www.icr.edu/ijcr/index.html > > > > > > *International Journal for Creation Research * > > > > > > The Institute for Creation Research is pleased to announce th= e > > >inaugural > > > Call for Papers for the International Journal of Creation > > >Research (IJCR). > > > > > > IJCR is a professional peer-reviewed journal of > > >interdisciplinary scientific > > > research that presents evidence for recent creation within a > > >biblical > > > framework. > > > > > > Addressing the need to disseminate the vast field of research > > >conducted by > > > experts in geology, genetics, astronomy, and other discipline= s > > >of science, > > > IJCR provides scientists and students hard data based on > > >cutting-edge > > > research that demonstrates the young earth model, the global > > >Flood, the > > > non-evolutionary origin of the species, and other evidences > > >that correlate > > > to the biblical accounts. > > > > > > It is our hope that you will be encouraged in your study of > > >creation science > > > issues that remain at the forefront of education and research= . > > > > > > Andrew A. Snelling > > > Editor-in-Chief > > > > > > -- > > > James L. Sparks Jr. M.Sc. > > > Freelance Ecology > > > 4530 E. Seminary Ave. > > > Richmond, VA 23227 > > > 804.426.2479 (cell) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >-- > > >James L. Sparks Jr. M.Sc. > > >Freelance Ecology > > >4530 E. Seminary Ave. > > >Richmond, VA 23227 > > >804.426.2479 (cell) > --=20 James L. Sparks Jr. M.Sc. Freelance Ecology 4530 E. Seminary Ave. Richmond, VA 23227 804.426.2479 (cell) "Quis custodiet ipso custodes?" -Juvenal
