Is it true that if the bull fights "nobely" that the crowd will cheer and
the bull gets rewarded by a life in the pasture??? I have always heard
this, but wonder if it is in fact true. Just because its written in a
children's book (Ferdinand) doesn't exactly mean it holds a lot of water! :)
Thanks for the feedback!
On Fri, Aug 20, 2010 at 4:01 AM, edgardo garrido <edgard...@hotmail.com>wrote:
> As "sports", bullfigting, hunting and other ways of killing species other
> than humans have been machismo demonstrations in the Mediterranean. It has
> been common not only in Spain but also in Southern France. Ancient romans
> were the ones giving this sense of "sport" to killing animals in front of
> everybody (remember the Coliseum). Moreover, since different wild animal
> species were used, some archaeologists consider it as a major reason for the
> extinction of many of such animals in Europe.
>
> The deepest origins of Bullfigting, however, are completely different: it
> appeared long before the Roman empire, in Crete, where beautiful women were
> dancing and jumping while the bulls were "trying to kill" them. It was a
> kind of "humanfigthing" made by the bull wich was considered connected to a
> kind of god: the Minotaurus. Romans were the ones converting such "games
> with animals" into "sports" killing the latter.
>
> I am panamanian and the main sport demonstrating machismo there is not
> Bullfighting but Boxing. Men knocking each other seems more human than
> bullfighting and the ancient greeks even had it as an olimpic discipline. No
> gloves, only the hands, and figthing until the moment when one says "okey,
> you won, I will stay laying on the floor". Cruel, but at least both
> participants belong to the same species and do it more volunterly while
> nobody asks a bull if he wants to fight. Again, romans were the ones
> converting it into a bloody "sport" and even gave weapons to the
> participants: gladiators. What a bloody way of being "macho"!
>
> My point is the following: bullfigthing belongs to a (rich) cultural
> heritage of the Mediterranean world. If people there like to play with
> animals, they should be encouraged to do it according to the non-bloody
> origins of the ritual. Perhaps banning to kill bulls in Spain is an
> opportunity to bullfighters to win their money by jumping upon the bulls as
> it was made in Crete. Many women enjoy to see the bullfighters because they
> find them sexy: their glamorouse clothes are tightly attached to their
> bodies. Well, such women would have more fun if these men start the ritual
> with such clothes and then take-off the clothes. Just for starting, they can
> take-off the shirt like saying "look at me, bull: I have no fear on you!",
> then put oil on their (semi)naked bodies and demonstrate gymnastic
> capabilities. Non-killing the bull would attract to the show many women who
> hate to see cruelty and blood on the arena. As biologists we know that such
> women can become healthyly excited so smart men can join them to see the
> show in order to share a nice session of peace and love after watching the
> bullfighters. Men non doing it will potentially have competitive
> disadvantage in sexual selection...
>
> >From a capitalists point of view, banning the "roman" version of
> bullfigthing and replacing it for a more "Crete" version is not a risk for
> the buiseness of bullfighting: it is an opportunity to make it more
> profitable.
>
> I have no coin. If you know any buisness man taking the idea, please tell
> him to pay me for it.
>
> Edgardo I. Garrido-Pérez
> Landscape Ecology department
> Goettingen University, Germany
>
> ¿De qué te vale tener si no sabes qué hacer con lo que tienes?
> Rubén Blades & Willie
> Colón
>
>
>
>
> > Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2010 14:29:33 -1000
> > From: ddu...@hawaii.edu
> > Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] Bullfighting
> > To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
> >
> > I hadn't wanted to get involved in this bull
> > (fighting) session but we all tend to have a
> > certain perspective that we think is the one true
> > right one. However, I am reminded of an example
> > of the Yupik and other Native Alaskans who are
> > appalled by fly fishing, while many more recent
> > arrivals in the Americas consider as the highest
> > truest form of fishing. The Yupik instead
> > consider it as "playing with your food" and this
> > is not something a grownup and moral person does,
> > sort of like bull fighting. You only fish if you
> > are going to eat it and you never torture your food.
> >
> > So one man's fly fishing is another's bull
> > fighting. The lesson is that cultures
> > distinguish themselves from one another by
> > finding something repulsive in the other.
> >
> > David Duffy
> >
> >
> >
> > At 10:53 AM 8/19/2010, malcolm McCallum wrote:
> > >Back in the 1970s my uncle (Douglas McCallum) in Joliet did a pencil
> sketch
> > >of a bullfighter.
> > >IT is a great picture, my uncle was an artist who did quite a bit of
> pretty
> > >good stuff in the 70s
> > >before he got injured and could no longer do it. Anyway, just as he
> > >finished the drawing, people
> > >started raising awareness of animal welfare issues associated with
> > >bullfighting. So, here he
> > >had this wonderful picture and no where to market it because of the
> stigma.
> > > My mother loved
> > >the picture and he gave it to her for christmas or something. Anyway,
> it
> > >hands over my parents
> > >sofa in the living room. It is a fantastic drawing of a significant
> part of
> > >Mexican and Spanish
> > >culture.
> > >
> > >It is interesting to me that bullfighting, whether we like it or not, is
> one
> > >area of culture that might
> > >be better disbanded, but is still a part of history and its cultural and
> > >historical significance still
> > >remains. There are many aspects of culture that are completely at odds
> with
> > >society.
> > >
> > >The difficult part is balancing where do we draw the line between
> cultural
> > >taboos and modern
> > >cultural values. We are increasingly faced in a broadening global
> society
> > >with cultural
> > >practices that stand very counter to our own values. I have no answers
> for
> > >how we deal
> > >with these conflicts, but it is important to recognize that such
> conflicts
> > >are more significant than
> > >the usual kinds of strife that we in american and the remainder of
> western
> > >society generally
> > >deal with.
> > >
> > >Malcolm
> > >
> > >On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 6:48 AM, William Silvert <cien...@silvert.org
> >wrote:
> > >
> > > > Since we recently had an exchange about the Catalonian ban on
> bullfighting,
> > > > I thought that this account of a bull fighting back might be of
> interest.
> > > > Ironically this was not a regular bullfight but rather a macho game
> of bull
> > > > dodging. Sort of the opposite of a Portuguese bullfight, where the
> bull
> > > > charges into a row of young men who try to wrestle it to the ground
> (the
> > > > horns are covered with wood, but the bull can still do a lot of
> damage).
> > > >
> > > > Raging bull rams spectators in Spain
> > > >
> > > > AFP AUGUST 19, 2010 7:20 AM
> > > >
> > > > A bull leaps out of the arena at a bullring in Tafalla near Pamplona,
> > > > northern Spain on August 18, 2010, and charged into a crowd of
> terrified
> > > > spectators. Some 30 people were injured.
> > > >
> > > > Three people, including a 10-year-old boy, remained in hospital
> Thursday
> > > > with injuries suffered when a bull charged into a crowd of terrified
> > > > spectators at a bullring in Spain, local authorities said.
> > > >
> > > > Spanish television showed dramatic images of screaming spectators,
> > > > including children, frantically trying to avoid the rampaging animal
> after
> > > > it leapt several metres (yards) over a security barrier and then
> clambered
> > > > over a fence and into the crowded stands Wednesday evening.
> > > >
> > > > The animal stumbled around the stands before falling down several
> steps,
> > > > crushing more people, at the bullring in the town of Tafalla, in the
> > > > northern Navarra region.
> > > >
> > > > Several employees of the bullring finally managed to get a rope
> around the
> > > > bull after about 15 minutes, and it was killed and removed by a
> crane.
> > > >
> > > > The Navarra regional government said 32 people were treated at
> hospitals
> > > > and clinics. Most suffered minor injuries such as bruising and were
> > > > released, but three remained hospitalized Thursday.
> > > >
> > > > A 10-year-old boy was in serious but stable condition with "abdominal
> > > > trauma" after the bull fell on him, it said in a statement.
> > > >
> > > > A 23-year-old woman was being treated for a crushed vertebrae, and a
> > > > 47-year-old man for wounds suffered when he was gored in the lower
> back.
> > > > Both were in stable condition.
> > > >
> > > > In addition to the 32, "several more" suffered shock or minor
> scratches and
> > > > bruises, the statement said.
> > > >
> > > > The incident did not take place during a traditional bullfight but
> during a
> > > > contest of "recortadores", in which
> > > participants try to dodge the bull while
> > > > staying as close to it as possible.
> > > >
> > > > The bull, named Quesero, had already twice tried to jump the barrier
> during
> > > > the event, breaking one of its horns, and was about to be removed
> from the
> > > > arena when it launched itself into the crowd.
> > > >
> > > > "I was terrified. I ran out of the stadium, crying," one young woman
> told
> > > > the television of the neighbouring Basque region.
> > > > Another young woman said, "people started to fall over each other . .
> .
> > > > Then I couldn't find my friends, what happened was awful."
> > > >
> > > > "I have never felt so afraid. I'm still shaking," one of those
> injured told
> > > > the ABC newspaper.
> > > >
> > > > "The bull had already made a few attempts, but I was relatively calm.
> And
> > > > suddenly, I saw that the animal had jumped and, after staying stuck
> on the
> > > > fence for a few seconds, it came over. Then there was chaos . . .
> There was
> > > > stomping, pushing, shrieks, blows."
> > > >
> > > > The Navarra government said most of the spectators were young people
> who
> > > > were able to react in time to avoid the bull, or the number of
> casualties
> > > > could have been far higher.
> > > >
> > > > Such incidents are very unusual at bullfights. Although the animals
> > > > occasionally manage to leap the security barrier they very rarely get
> into
> > > > the stands.
> > > >
> > > > Wednesday's incident came amid intense debate in Spain over the
> > > > centuries-old tradition of bullfighting.
> > > >
> > > > The northeastern region of Catalonia last month became the first part
> of
> > > > mainland Spain to ban the practice, which
> > > animal activists condemn as a form
> > > > of torture and others see as part of the country's cultural heritage.
> > > >
> > > > In a recent opinion poll, 60 per cent of Spaniards said they do not
> approve
> > > > of the spectacle, which ends with the death of the bull from a
> well-placed
> > > > sword.
> > > >
> > > > Navarra, where Tafalla is located, is famous for the traditional
> "running
> > > > of the bulls" in the regional capital of Pamplona.
> > > > Dozens of people are injured each year when the runners try to
> outrace
> > > > bulls which charge through the old town's
> > > narrow streets to a bullring where
> > > > a bullfight is staged.
> > > >
> > > > © Copyright (c) AFP
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >Malcolm L. McCallum
> > >Managing Editor,
> > >Herpetological Conservation and Biology
> > >
> > >1880's: "There's lots of good fish in the sea" W.S. Gilbert
> > >1990's: Many fish stocks depleted due to overfishing, habitat loss,
> > > and pollution.
> > >2000: Marine reserves, ecosystem restoration, and pollution reduction
> > > MAY help restore populations.
> > >2022: Soylent Green is People!
> > >
> > >Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message, including any
> > >attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may
> > >contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized
> > >review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not
> > >the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and
> > >destroy all copies of the original message.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > David Cameron Duffy
> > Professor of Botany and Unit Leader
> > Pacific Cooperative Studies Unit (PCSU)
> > University of Hawai`i
> > 3190 Maile Way St. John 410
> > Honolulu, HI 96822-2279
> > (808) 956-8218 phone
> > (808) 956-4710 fax / (808) 956-3923 (backup fax)
> > email address: ddu...@hawaii.edu
>
--
Malcolm L. McCallum
Managing Editor,
Herpetological Conservation and Biology
1880's: "There's lots of good fish in the sea" W.S. Gilbert
1990's: Many fish stocks depleted due to overfishing, habitat loss,
and pollution.
2000: Marine reserves, ecosystem restoration, and pollution reduction
MAY help restore populations.
2022: Soylent Green is People!
Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message, including any
attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may
contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized
review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not
the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and
destroy all copies of the original message.
