Chas, et al, Yes, great responses; lot’s of experience out there.
To answer your recent expression of your question we need to understand that the world is not static; people move around plus come and go. Altho I get more that my share of ‘We have a product to ship next week that needs CE, can you come in and do that for us’ (which has led to some very interesting projects), most places that are working with all of this regulatory web of issues understand that they need to meet the requirements and expect the design teams to come up to speed on the details. This is a moving target; how many 10s of thousands of new engineers are graduated in the world each year and sucked up into companies and are given significant assignments with minimal supervision and training. This leads to one of my basic understandings as to what I do. The collective members of the project teams are like a stew and the ‘cook’ (company leader at some level) stirs the pot regularly to make a better outcome. This provided opportunities for us knowledgeable folks to jump in and do handholding and informal training in all of this as part of our work on a project. It’s usually satisfying if you like to help folks do their job well (and they accept the help). Because of the addition of newbies regularly and the ever changing requirements this is a never ending cycle (and opportunity). So, Chas, yes, the experienced folks are getting better and better at this stuff and they have a high pass rate with the labs. They don’t stay in one place too long if they are very good. Opportunity exists to help the present team improve in what they do. Anyone want to replace me so I can really retire and get back to more fishing? :>) br, Pete Peter E Perkins, PE Principal Product Safety & Regulatory Affairs Consultant PO Box 1067 Albany, ORe 97321-0413 503/452-1201 IEEE Life Fellow IEEE PSES 2020 Distinguished Lecturer <http://www.researchgate.net/Peter%20Perkins> www.researchgate.net search my name <mailto:p.perk...@ieee.org> p.perk...@ieee.org Entropy ain’t what it used to be From: Grasso, Charles [Outlook] <charles.gra...@dish.com> Sent: Monday, May 24, 2021 12:07 PM To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Subject: Re: [PSES] What percentage of products pass first time? Hi all – What wonderful responses. I understand that without the proper processes in attention that the chances of passing first time is low indeed. One could argue that the first time passers have such a system in place and I was interested in how much EMC has been integrated into the product design process in recent years! Chas From: Richard Nute <ri...@ieee.org <mailto:ri...@ieee.org> > Sent: Monday, May 24, 2021 12:45 PM To: Grasso, Charles [Outlook] <charles.gra...@dish.com <mailto:charles.gra...@dish.com> >; EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG <mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG> Subject: RE: [PSES] What percentage of products pass first time? This message originated outside of DISH and was sent by: ri...@ieee.org <mailto:ri...@ieee.org> Hi Charles: Not what you asked for, but a set of principles for success with third-party testing, from a product safety point of view: 1. The design engineer and the product safety engineer should be able to predict the outcome of any test. 2. Testing simply confirms (or not) the prediction. 3. Failure of a test or other requirement at the third-party delays the third-party investigation which can imperil the product schedule. To maintain schedule, the product must comply with all tests before it is submitted to the third-party. 4. If the product that you successfully tested fails a third-party test, then your or the third-party test was in error. This can open a dialogue between you and the third-party as to test process. 5. Tests to standards requirements are either pass or fail; always record the measurement. If the test requires a stimulation, then adjust the stimulation to the point of failure and record the measurement. Both tell you the margin between pass and failure. 6. Provide your measurement data to the third-party when you submit the product. If the third-party measurement data differs from your data, some third-parties will do their own investigation as to why. In my opinion, EMC is not a black art and can follow these same principles. Stay safe, and best regards, Rich From: Grasso, Charles [Outlook] <charles.gra...@dish.com <mailto:charles.gra...@dish.com> > Sent: Monday, May 24, 2021 7:47 AM To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG <mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG> Subject: [PSES] What percentage of products pass first time? Hello EMC gurus! Calling all labs - In your experience how many products pass the Unintentional Emissions test first time? - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. 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To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <emc-p...@ieee.org> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <sdoug...@ieee.org> Mike Cantwell <mcantw...@ieee.org> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: <j.bac...@ieee.org> David Heald: <dhe...@gmail.com>