> > The cheapest system I could find is by Leadshine in China and the > smallest size controller is $350 per axis but they are unable to > support you if you are in North America buying low retail quantities. > > I looked into what it would take to build a DIY Ethercat based client > controller. The minimum buy-in to get started with DIY Ethercat > slaves requires assess to Beckhoff ASIC chips, the ability make your > own 4 sided PCBs and re-flow soldering ovens. Basically professional > level electrical engineering skills and equipment > > I looked into using FPGA solutions and found the low-end FPGA > development boards are not nearly fastest enough.
These is exactly wath I think .... Only that you can use Estun instead of Bosh for 1/4 of the price .... but there is no security on ethercat in this case. That being said, the biggest problem is the slaves and the chip asic ... anyway I must add that even slaves that already exist on the market do not have the same performance that can give a plc (true plc non softplc) commercial too low cost. And this is the real obstacle that has stopped my tests to create a professional ethercat linuxcnc system. I would say that the problem of axle driving is secondary, indeed the axle piloting already well, so less than having to create machines with a rt lower than 1ms. For adding some other info, there are some fpga card redy with asic chip and custom develop in C or ready to connect at your pc, but the cost is the same of pc. So the system is too expensive. I am quite convinced that in two or three years all these obstacles will disappear, so that bus rt over ethernet will be within reach. And it is not said that the favorite will be ethercat. There is a lot of movement over bus rt over ethernet .... so you can expect everything ... think what might go for example if google wanted to come back to bostondynamics .... it's a very extreme example but it's just for make the idea. bkt 2017-10-28 23:02 GMT+02:00 Chris Albertson <albertson.ch...@gmail.com>: > I disagree a little. I think the problem is only money, not > technical. Yes it seems to be well past the technical ability of > most of the DIY community. > > If you can stand $2,000 or more per axis Bosh (intraDrive) will sell > you a really nice system and they can support it. They are driven by > can bus or Ethercat. If you have a $200,000 robot spot welding > machine that builds automotive car bodies, what is a new grand per > axis? > > The cheapest system I could find is by Leadshine in China and the > smallest size controller is $350 per axis but they are unable to > support you if you are in North America buying low retail quantities. > > I looked into what it would take to build a DIY Ethercat based client > controller. The minimum buy-in to get started with DIY Ethercat > slaves requires assess to Beckhoff ASIC chips, the ability make your > own 4 sided PCBs and re-flow soldering ovens. Basically professional > level electrical engineering skills and equipment > > I looked into using FPGA solutions and found the low-end FPGA > development boards are not nearly fastest enough. > > > > On Sat, Oct 28, 2017 at 2:13 AM, theman whosoldtheworld > <bleachk...@gmail.com> wrote: > > Ok. Just fun I would say it's a good thing. I also tried the Estun. I > would > > say great product for the price paid. If you have to do a 3D printer that > > works for 48 hours, or an electrorube device, I recommend you continue to > > use mesa cards.Personally, I did not have problems on the drive side, > but I > > had problems deleting the digital outputs of an I / O slave ... Delays in > > the order of 50ms and I only noticed after 4 hours of work. As I saw > this I > > stopped the tests and found out that the problem came from the bus > > (although I do not know how) .... using the outputs on board a 7i66 > > everything work fine. > > > > in any case my warning to avoid for now using realtime ethernet buses is > in > > the fact that the producers are selling too little performance software > > compared to the ardware on board. So they want to do too many things .... > > but in some time I guess the right hardware will become economical enough > > because it can be mounted on the devices. > > > > That said this next month I will start a new test with a different > product > > .... and I hope in January to be able to put on board a commercial plc > > rt-ethernet open source. > > > > bkt > > > > > > 2017-10-27 12:40 GMT+02:00 Nicklas Karlsson < > nicklas.karlsso...@gmail.com>: > > > >> I make my own hardware, it's only for fun and I do not intend to earn > money > >> on it. It's however useful to know how it works during normal working > >> hours. > >> > >> 2017-10-27 11:07 GMT+02:00 theman whosoldtheworld <bleachk...@gmail.com > >: > >> > >> > I use the suggestion and indication from linuxcnc forum: > >> > > >> > https://forum.linuxcnc.org/24-hal-components/22346-ethercat- > hal-driver > >> > > >> > about SOEM, The basic implement is not realtime .... so is ok for user > >> > command, not so for drive command. Any how my decision is not utilize > >> > ethernet bus for drive position/velocity/torque command. Mesa analogue > >> > signal and feedback encoder on mesa card are too easy and precise > signals > >> > to use to go for alternative methods that usually do not give such > good > >> > performances. Keep in mind that realtime on ethercat is not a > universal > >> > value ... commercially there are devices that go under 1 ms but others > >> that > >> > arrive up to 10-20ms .... for example kunbus has made devices on pi3 > with > >> > ethercat and more, but with a realtime of 5ms. > >> > > >> > I have made the opinion that bus-rt on ethernet are very nice, but > they > >> > will really be useful only in some have. in the meantime it is best to > >> play > >> > on to be ready and wait. If you would use it for data comm between > some > >> > device or for connect some device without problem of 5-10ms response > time > >> > all work fine. I could not recommend any ethercat for professional use > >> as a > >> > result of my experiences. But I'm sure many others have taken > advantage > >> of > >> > it. > >> > > >> > Last but no least, there is also the security issue. Here in Europe > >> > ethernet-ip and secure signals do not agree much for example. In > >> addition, > >> > many drive manufacturers do not have safety over ethercat even if they > >> have > >> > the bus. > >> > > >> > > >> > regards > >> > bkt > >> > > >> > 2017-10-26 18:19 GMT+02:00 Nicklas Karlsson < > >> nicklas.karlsso...@gmail.com> > >> > : > >> > > >> > > On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 13:36:26 +0200 > >> > > theman whosoldtheworld <bleachk...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> > > > >> > > > I'm working with it now using linuxcnc implementation ... and in > past > >> > > with > >> > > > backoff device. ... > >> > > > >> > > I just started to look a day or two ago, which Ethercat > implementation? > >> > > > >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > >> > > ------------------ > >> > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > >> > > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > >> > > _______________________________________________ > >> > > Emc-users mailing list > >> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > >> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > >> > > > >> > ------------------------------------------------------------ > >> > ------------------ > >> > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > >> > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > >> > _______________________________________________ > >> > Emc-users mailing list > >> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > >> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > >> > > >> ------------------------------------------------------------ > >> ------------------ > >> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > >> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Emc-users mailing list > >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > ------------------ > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > > _______________________________________________ > > Emc-users mailing list > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > > > > -- > > Chris Albertson > Redondo Beach, California > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > ------------------ > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > _______________________________________________ > Emc-users mailing list > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot _______________________________________________ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
