Hi Roger, It's ok not to be obsessed with cleaning up the environment, but why be intolerant of people who are? Same with people who spend a lot of time talking in public about issues of racial discrimination. If you are going to speak and act on behalf of millions of people who are not speaking and acting, it is understandable that you might also be the type of person who is strongly motivated.
What you don't seem to appreciate is that being able to not have to think about race is a luxury that non-whites do not have. That doesn't mean you have to make the world fair for everyone, but the least that we who have that luxury could do is acknowledge that we have that privilege. Have you ever considered what it would be like for you in a world with an alternate history? Where the Cherokee Nation developed guns and steel before the Europeans and colonized it using Siberian slaves instead? You could listen to descendants of those invaders and slavers discuss how the whining of pink people, their scapegoats and victims for centuries in a hostile land, is really not their cup of tea. Craig On Monday, September 10, 2012 7:19:44 AM UTC-4, rclough wrote: > > Hi Craig Weinberg > > Not that I am against cleaning up the environment, but I am not > obsessed with the idea. Integrating with Nature is also a main principle > of the Communist Manifesto. > > > Roger Clough, rclo...@verizon.net <javascript:> > 9/10/2012 > Leibniz would say, "If there's no God, we'd have to invent him > so that everything could function." > > ----- Receiving the following content ----- > *From:* Craig Weinberg <javascript:> > *Receiver:* everything-list <javascript:> > *Time:* 2012-09-09, 16:23:54 > *Subject:* Re: Racism ? How's that implied ? > > > > On Sunday, September 9, 2012 2:58:32 PM UTC-4, Stephen Paul King wrote: >> >> On 9/9/2012 2:21 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote: >> >> On Sunday, September 9, 2012 1:41:37 PM UTC-4, Stephen Paul King wrote: >>> >>> Hi Craig, >>> >>> Why are we even considering the thoughts of paranoids? Are they in >>> control of our daily lives? >>> >>> >>> >> Hi Stephen, >> >> I agree, I was responding to what Roger said about liberals: >> >> "ironically and paradoxically they see the world in terms of race. >> Conservatives attempt to live by facts. I never >> saw racism in what what I wrote until you brought >> the subject up." >> >> which sounded to me like 'conservatives aren't racist, liberals are', >> which - although conservative thought has some admirable virtues, I can say >> without hesitation that tolerance for racial and gender diversity is not >> one of them. That's why I brought up JBS and KKK, to show the absurdity of >> that claim, since the most racist hate groups are known to be political >> right wing extremists and not left wing extremists. >> >> >> HI Craig, >> >> The contest of recrimination is not winnable, but let's try for the >> sake of the discussion. >> >> >> Personally I don't know of any left wing extremist groups in this country >> - not that there aren't any but even self-proclaimed anarchists seem to >> stay out of trouble. >> >> >> I guess that you have never heard of >> >> 1) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_First! >> > 2) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_Liberation_Front >> > > I had heard of Earth First but not much. Yeah, I think it's fair to call > them left wing eco-terrorists. Unfortunately the way they are going about > it, using arson and destruction will only serve to discredit their cause > and provide a ready excuse for stepping up surveillance and security > operations around the world. I don't think that mainstream liberals are > aware or support groups like this though generally. Contrary to the > overwhelming drift to the right by conservatives, groups like these have > not seemed to influence the politics of the mainstream (Democrats can't > really even be called liberals, more like fiscal conservatives who are > socially moderate). > > >> 3) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenpeace >> > > What do they do that is bad? Do they threaten innocent people? Maybe they > are over-zealous and unrealistic about ecological priorities but it's a > drop in the bucket compared to the global machine they are up against. From > what I see it looks like they mainly are concerned with protecting human > beings in general: > http://yqyq.net/81737-Istoriya_i_dostizheniya_Greenpeace.html > > Certainly they are not racists or bullies of innocent people. > > > >> 4) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Students_for_a_Democratic_Society >> > > SDS lasted from 1960-1969, so it hasn't been relevant for almost 50 years. > I had a professor who was in SDS. Extremely nice and gentle guy. He said he > had a metal plate in his skull from the FBI. His class was on revolutionary > movements, talked about SDS, the IWW and labor unions. He seemed to have a > mature and reasonable perspective on the 60s > > >> >> need more? >> >> > > sure. my point was about racism though. Are there any groups of white > racists who are liberal? > > >> >> In other parts of the world, there are certainly left-wing violent >> extremists but I don't guess that they are racially motivated in particular >> (unless maybe the distribution of wealth and power falls along racial lines >> in their area). What are the left wing presences in the US? Farmers >> markets? Small organizations that try to help people get birth control or >> protect people from being poisoned by industry? >> >> >> It might be helpful if you laid out for us the definition of the >> terms that you are using. What exactly is left-wing and right-wing? >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left-wing_politics >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right-wing_politics >> >> Why can't we just get along? >> > > The left wing are those who see themselves as being the people who want to > just get along or, if politically active, oppose those who prevent us from > getting along. Left wing means tolerance, which means a certain degree of > intolerance of intolerance. That's where it gets dicey. > > I'm not sure who the right wing thinks they are. Patriots? Grownups who > don't like to see people get anything without paying a price? Not sure. > > > >> >> To my mind, while I can understand why liberals would be criticized as >> whiny, weak, and impractical, I think conservatives who do not understand >> why they are criticized as racist, anti-intellectual bullies are in deep >> denial or just sheltered from other viewpoints. >> >> Craig >> >> >> From my point of view we need objectivity. >> > > I'm on board with that. > > Tell me why didn't trickle down economics work? Why did Bush's 8-year > presidency end in such catastrophic failure? Why haven't the corps making > record profits behaved as the 'job creators' they are supposed to be? > > Craig > > >> -- >> Onward! >> >> Stephen >> http://webpages.charter.net/stephenk1/Outlaw/Outlaw.html >> >> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/everything-list/-/gJQQzjbw3VwJ. > To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com<javascript:> > . > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > everything-li...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/everything-list/-/nsBbWmgc2w4J. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en.
