Dear Bruno, I really do appreciate the details!
On Tue, Dec 31, 2013 at 5:04 AM, Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be> wrote: > > On 30 Dec 2013, at 19:33, meekerdb wrote: > > On 12/30/2013 1:41 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 30 Dec 2013, at 02:59, meekerdb wrote: > > On 12/29/2013 4:41 PM, LizR wrote: > > On 30 December 2013 09:35, Edgar L. Owen <edgaro...@att.net> wrote: > >> Liz, >> >> Good questions. The computations take place in P-time which is the >> universal processor cycle in which they execute. The results of the >> computations compute dimensional space and CLOCK time. >> >> So an external time dimension is required. > > So imagine a universe with a time dimension and some space-less > computations...I'll try. > > > This shouldn't be any harder than imagining Bruno's Turing machine > computing everything...including space and time. > > > Space, time and physical things are not computed. They emerge in the > view of "self-aware" Löbian machine, which exist in arithmetic. > > > But not all of arithmetic is computed by the UD, > > > OK. The UD, seen as a prover, proves only the "ExP(x)" truth, but of > course it obeys itself to the whole of arithmetic, for example, it will > never emulate a correct machine proving a false pi_1 statements (AxP(x)). > > > The notion of self-obedience, is that a form of self-reference? > > so how can you be sure that this Lobian machine emerges? > > > Because the existence of some Löbian machine is a sigma_1 (even sigma_0) > sentence, as his the existence of their finite piece of computational > histories. > OK. Does this follow from Lowenheim-Skolem? > > > > How does it emerge? > > > The UD, alias RA, emulates all machines. > I see this as true, but in the sense of a static representational model. There is no "action" involved! > > > > And if there is one, aren't there indefinitely many emerging? > > > Yes, there are infinitely many emerging, and that is why there is a global > relative 1-indeterminacy on the whole UD*, or RA emulation. > Are you saying that the FPI obtains from the infinite number of "emergings"? Does it have to be "global"? I worry about this because it seems to assume a privileged observer that has the ability to simultaneously perceive all of the emergings. I reject that "God's eye view". > > Bruno > > > > > Brent > > The universal machine does not compute everything---only the sigma_1 > truth. With comp "everything" is the whole arithmetical truth, not just all > computations. It is also the truth about those computations, and 99,999 % > of those truth are not computed by any machine. Goldbach conjecture is true > of false, but not computed. It may be be proved by this or that machine, > but that is independent of its truth or falsity. > > To understand comp, you need only to conceive that some can have the > faith of surviving with a digital brain. The TOE itself asks you just to > believe in addition and multiplication. > > Bruno > > > > > Brent > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the > Google Groups "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this topic, visit > https://groups.google.com/d/topic/everything-list/7G5zm5OFT0k/unsubscribe. > To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to > everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > -- Kindest Regards, Stephen Paul King Senior Researcher Mobile: (864) 567-3099 stephe...@provensecure.com http://www.provensecure.us/ “This message (including any attachments) is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed, and may contain information that is non-public, proprietary, privileged, confidential and exempt from disclosure under applicable law or may be constituted as attorney work product. 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