> On 26 Jul 2018, at 21:03, John Clark <johnkcl...@gmail.com> wrote: > > On Tue, Jul 24, 2018 at 9:47 AM, Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be > <mailto:marc...@ulb.ac.be>> wrote: > > >>In a world that contains first person duplicating machines there is no such > >>thing as THE first person. > > >That would contradict computationalism immediately, because it would mean > >that the first person in M has disappeared > > So in Brunomath if C is consciousness and C is duplicated then 2*C=0.
Just 1*C, and not according to my math, but yours. You are the one saying that the guy in W has to be the only “the”, when I insist that they are BOTH a unique “the”, of course from the first person view (which is the subject of the question asked in Helsinki). > Are you sure you're a mathematician? > > > or is a zombie, > > Or a vampire or a werwolf or a fire breathing dragon. Isn't it time for you > to start babbling about telepathy? > > >You seem to remain unable to put yourself in any possible continuation. > You remain unable to put yourself in more than one continuation if *YOU* have > been copied in a *YOU* duplicating machine. > > On the contrary, we have to put oneself at the place of both copies, and both says something like “I am the one feeling to be uniquely in a unique city”. So in Helsinki P(to fell in one city) = 1. > > >You seem to deny that in W, the guy feel to be only in W, and is aware he > >could not have predicted that outcome, > > Before the Helsinki was copied Mr. He couldn't have predicted the outcome or > dome anything else for that matter because back then Mr. He did not exist. Then you change the criteria of identity, and also you make comp false, as if the H guy cease to exist, we can no more give sense to “surviving with a digital brain”. > > >>I can give a precise logically consistent definition of "Abbey", why can't > >>you? > > >I can, but [...] > > Ah yes, the all important "but". It is said it is wise to ignore everything a > politician says before "but", and the same thing applies to you. > > >we have to distinguish the 1p and the 3p. > > Then do so! Give me a definition of "Abbey" that is as precise and logically > consistent as the one I gave. I don't think you can do it. > > Nor it is needed. You are the one saying that the H-guy can predict what he will feel, but you have not yet given an algorithm. Once you did, but it was debunked by many in this list. > > >Abbey is indeed surviving in both W and M, > That statement will remain neither true nor false until you give us a precise > and logically consistent definition of “Abbey" > We did that. See previous post. We have agree on the identity of person definition, and even on the difference between first and third person at some point. You should not ask the same question again and again. All the definitions are in all may papers on this subject. > and don't change it from one paragraph to the next. I can do it why can't you? > > > >We have agreed on all name and pronoun this time. > > Then what did we agree that "Abbey" means?? >> >>> as lived by any copies, which obviously cannot have a first person >> >>> perception of the two cities at once FROM that first person perspective. >> >> >>That depends entirely on who the person in the first person perspective >> >>you keep talking about is! > > >All of them > If all of them are "Abbey" then "Abbey" saw 2 cities at the same time, > Not from any of the abbey’s pop, after the duplication and opening of the reconstitution box. You keep abstracting yourself from the 3P and 1P difference, which in this context is 3p defined (content of diary outside the box (3p) and taken in the box (1p). Bruno > but I don't think that's what you really mean by "Abbey", I don't think you > know what you mean by "Abbey". Prove me wrong, give me a precise logically > consistent definition of "Abbey" and let me hold you to it from one paragraph > to the next and from one post to the next. > > > John K Clark > > > >> > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com > <mailto:everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com > <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list > <https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list>. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout > <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
