> On 4 Jul 2021, at 22:29, John Clark <johnkcl...@gmail.com> wrote: > > On Sun, Jul 4, 2021 at 3:36 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List > <everything-list@googlegroups.com <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> > wrote: > > >> I think I mentioned before that in David Deutsch's book "The Ghost In The > >> Atom" he proposed an experimental test that would be very difficult, but > >> not impossible, to perform that could decide between Copenhagen and Many > >> Worlds; and the reason it's so difficult is not Many Worlds fault, the > >> reason is that the conventional view says conscious observers obey > >> different laws of physics, Many Worlds says they do not, so to test who's > >> right we need a mind that uses quantum properties and algorithms. An > >> intelligent quantum computer shoots photons at a metal plate one at a time > >> that has 2 small slits in it, and then the photons hit a photographic > >> plate. Nobody looks at the photographic plate till the very end of the > >> experiment. The quantum mind has detectors near each slit so it knows > >> which slit the various photons went through. After each photon passes the > >> slits, but before they hit the photographic plate, the quantum mind signs > >> a document saying that it has observed each and every photon and knows > >> which slit each photon went through. It is very important that the > >> document does NOT say which slit a photon went through, it only says that > >> it went through one slit and only one slit and the mind has knowledge of > >> which one. There is a signed document to this effect for every photon it > >> shoots. Now the mind uses quantum erasure to completely destroy its memory > >> of which slit any of the photons went through; the only part remaining in > >> the universe is the document which states that each photon went through > >> one and only one slit and the mind (at the time) knew which one. Now > >> develop the photographic plate and look at it. If you see interference > >> bands then the Many World interpretation is correct. If you do not see > >> interference bands then there are no worlds but this one and the > >> conventional quantum interpretation is correct. This works because in the > >> Copenhagen interpretation when the results of a measurement enters the > >> consciousness of an observer the wave function collapses, in effect all > >> the universes except one disappear without a trace so you get no > >> interference. In the Many Worlds model all the other worlds will converge > >> back into one universe because information on which slit the various > >> photons went through was the only thing that made one universe different > >> from another, so when that was erased they became identical again and > >> merged, but their influence will still be felt, you'll see ambiguous > >> evidence that the photon went through slot A only and ambiguous evidence > >> it went through slot B only, and that's what causes the interference > >> pattern. > > > And it doesn't work because it assumes that which-way can be both observed > > and yet quantum erased. That's contrary to decoherence theory of "observed" > > I don't know what you're talking about. An intelligent quantum computer is > perfectly capable of creating a document specifying that at a certain time it > had information in its memory banks that indicated which slot a photon went > through but not actually mentioning which slot it was, and at a later time a > quantum computer is also capable of using quantum erasure to remove that > which way information from its memory banks so there no longer exists > information anywhere about which slit the photon went through, although there > is still knowledge that at one time that information was in its memory banks. > > > and assumes some magic "quantum consciousness", hiding the problem behind a > > lack of definition of consciousness. > >
The mechanist theory of consciousness (the theory which put the less magic here) explains directly the many histories aspect of nature. A physical apparent object is only a map on the accessible continuation of our histories. The use of quantum to explain consciousness is mainly fraudulent. It explains something mysterious from something made even more mysterious. The mechanist theory of consciousness (given by the 8 modes of self-reference imposed by incompleteness (the theology)) justify the quantum. The link quantum-consciousness makes sense, but it is the other way round. > Wow, as enigmatic and bazaar as your first remark was, this one is even more > so! The entire point of this experiment is to determine if conscious stuff > operates according to the same laws of physics as non-conscious stuff, I'm > betting that they do. The matter obeys the laws of the machine observable, but there are different laws for each modes of self-reference, yet entirely explained by incompleteness. The fundamental laws are simply Kxy = x and Sxyz = xz(yz) or anything Turing equivalent. Many people continue to believe in the God “Matter”, but that is the God we can be pretty sure does not exist, once we bet on mechanism. 2+2=4 or KKK = K are enough to explain the illusion of matter for all universal machine (infinitely distributed in the arithmetical reality). Materialism is like vitalism: a metaphysical principle which cannot work (assuming mechanism). Materialism will disappear as a lasting superstition... Bruno > John K Clark See what's on my new list at Extropolis > <https://groups.google.com/g/extropolis> > lts9 > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com > <mailto:everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAJPayv2dpEVC%2BPwioAm9K%3D_Wsc4F5EiBCLrv8%3DY-RQ%3DxzQEwuw%40mail.gmail.com > > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAJPayv2dpEVC%2BPwioAm9K%3D_Wsc4F5EiBCLrv8%3DY-RQ%3DxzQEwuw%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/929BE1E2-F186-4B57-B335-214095250DC9%40ulb.ac.be.
