Only that politicians and political rules are stupid.
John Matteson Geac Corporate ISS (404) 239 - 2981 Atlanta, Georgia, USA. -----Original Message----- From: Greg Deckler [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Posted At: Monday, December 22, 2003 1:22 PM Posted To: Exchange Discussion List Conversation: Greg's Utterly Fascinating Views on Ethics Subject: RE: Greg's Utterly Fascinating Views on Ethics I've argued the theory on this too many times now. Let me provide a specific example. At time, I wear a Novell leather jacket. I received this jacket at the end of a project for the State of Ohio. Basically, the State of Ohio gave Novell something like $1 million for implementing a G-NOC. I worked on this project and at the end Novell gave out about 50 of these leater jackets to people that worked on the project in this big huge ceremony that was held. The director at the State of Ohio was forced to resign over accepting his leather jacket because of conflict of interest rules. So, the State of Ohio had ALREADY paid Novell ALL of the money and THEN Novell gave out these gifts and the director at the State of Ohio was STILL found to have violated conflict of interest rules. Does that make anything more clear? > Where's the conflict if Ed consults on Microsoft products? They come > to him for MS products! > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Greg Deckler > Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 1:10 PM > To: Exchange Discussions > Subject: RE: Greg's Utterly Fascinating Views on Ethics > > You can be offended all you want, it does not change the FACT that > accepting a direct gift from a vendor creates an obvious problem with > basic conflict of interest rules. I don't make these rules up all I > have stated is that a real or perceived conflict exists. If the > argument held no water, then there would be no reason to be offended. > > > It's not exactly a gift. It's a recognition for a contribution > pefrormed. > > There are, admittedly, strings attached, although there are none > >that=20 I consider to be ethical issues. > >=20 > > I completely resent your entire assertion that I am somehow > >unethical=20 because I accept the title and gifts associated with > >being an MVP. I=20 will defend my standards of ethics against > >anyone's, including your=20 poorly defined and indefensible set. In > >fact, I was nearly fired from > > > my current job because I defended ethical behavior, but the > >system=20 worked and I am still here. (This was completely > >unrelated to=20 anything surrounding Microsoft or MVP.) =20 So, > >let's get back to the real argument. Please either (1) prove how=20 > >being an MVP is unethical, or (2) go away and let this thread rest. > >I > > > tire of your repeated extrapolations, digressions, and=20 > >less-than-brilliant treatises. > >=20 > > Ed Crowley MCSE+Internet MVP > > Freelance E-Mail Philosopher > > Protecting the world from PSTs and Bricked Backups!T =20 > >-----Original Message----- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Greg > >Deckler > > Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 9:51 AM > > To: Exchange Discussions > > Subject: RE: Greg's Utterly Fascinating Views on Ethics =20 The > >flaw here is that that "Cisco Certified" has clearly defined=20 > >things that must be met and requires a payment to the vendor to=20 > >achieve. You must PAY to get the required material. You must PAY > >to=20 take the tests. You must PAY for the certification. > >=20 > > MVP is a gift. There are no explicit requirements and there is no=20 > >exchange of currency. > >=20 > > This is the CLEAR difference between certifications and gifts like > MVP. > >=20 > > > Titles based on criteria that has been successfully met, as in > > >MVP=20 or Cisco Certified, etc., has no ethical issues. It is an > > >earned=20 title that denotes an area of expertise. It is up to > > >those who view=20 the title to determine if the criteria for > > >getting the title=20 warrants a level of trust and respect. > > >=20 > > > Personal gifts from vendors that you make purchasing decisions=20 > > >regarding is unethical. > > >=20 > > > Rules of ethics are necessary in this business. > > >=20 > > > Ceaselessly arguing in order to have the last word is poor use > > >of=20 brain power, poor use of this list and poor use of ethics. > > >Anyone=20 whose priority is to *always* win the "fight" must > > >sacrifice the=20 truth and good judgment, thereby violating basic ethics. > > >=20 > > > Just another opinion :-) > > >=20 > > > Best Regards,=3D20 > > >=20 > > > Dan Bartley > > >=20 > > >=20 > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Greg Deckler [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 12:24 > > > To: Exchange Discussions > > > Subject: RE: Greg's Utterly Fascinating Views on Ethics =20 I got > > >to the first paragraph in your post and pretty much quit=20 > > >reading.=3D20 > >=20 > > _________________________________________________________________ > > List posting FAQ: http://www.swinc.com/resource/exch_faq.htm > > Web Interface: > > = > http://intm-dl.sparklist.com/cgi-bin/lyris.pl?enter=3Dexchange&text_mo > de > > =3D&lang > > =3Denglish > > To unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Exchange List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > _________________________________________________________________ > List posting FAQ: http://www.swinc.com/resource/exch_faq.htm > Web Interface: > http://intm-dl.sparklist.com/cgi-bin/lyris.pl?enter=3Dexchange&text_mo > de=3D= > & > lang=3Denglish > To unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Exchange List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] _________________________________________________________________ List posting FAQ: http://www.swinc.com/resource/exch_faq.htm Web Interface: http://intm-dl.sparklist.com/cgi-bin/lyris.pl?enter=exchange&text_mode=&; lang=english To unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Exchange List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] _________________________________________________________________ List posting FAQ: http://www.swinc.com/resource/exch_faq.htm Web Interface: http://intm-dl.sparklist.com/cgi-bin/lyris.pl?enter=exchange&text_mode=&lang=english To unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Exchange List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
