Oh dear Oh dear I could guess a discussion of the merits of vi(m) would cause much argument. I have been using UNIX variants for 12 years now. And have run courses on UNIX and editors such as vi. I also am a great fan of Windows based computing for ease of use purposes. I also don't understand the problem - I have installed Mandrake 7 recently and have edited all sorts of files from the GUI - why can't this be done here? As far as ease of use - well yes - it is easier to use a GUI editor for small changes. There IS some learning to use any new program - especially if it is text based. BUT for vi you only need to know 9 commands to do almost anything you want. a - append after character i - insert at character x - delete current character dd - delete line ESC - exit editing mode Next 3 for exiting: wq - write changes (save) and quit wq! - write changes and quit (forced) even if file is read only q! - quit with no changes written arrow keys - move around file Main rule - always press ESCAPE key to ensure no commands are running There are many more commands adding seriously powerful editing ability. I think my message is - calm down and use what suits you best. >On Mon, 14 Aug 2000, Mallard wrote: > >> Why did Mandrake pick the most geekyist editor for a setup that is >> suposto be easy for users? >> >> Anyone else seen this joke of a program? >> >> With Vim all you have to do is spend a half hour trying to get it give >> you help, then scroll all the way to the bottom of a super long >> whoopy-do list of usless keyboard commands that you will forget a day >> after you use them. Please get rid of it! >> >> Try ":qw" to get out and save what you just did WTF is that? Did a human >> design this? That is if you figure out how to get into "insert" mode and >> out of it again. GET RID OF THIS! TRASH IT! Ban it from the Net! >> >> Couldn't use "X" or "E" for exit or maybe cntl-X or Z, no - had to be >> big geeks and do it some STUPID way. What the hell were these guys >> thinking? Do they live on this planet? Why does Mandrake support this? >> Trash it! >> >> Yea, I am pissed. All I wanted to do is set up my cron file ("crontab >> -e") and that brings up the "default" editor. Searching all over to find >> where the "default" editor is set up, couldn't find it. Another waste of >> time. >> >> I don't know who thinks this is some great thing, WOW! It has zillions >> of features! It's not 1982 anymore, we have word processors that have a >> better human interface than terminals did, get a life geeks! (directed >> at the guys who wrote and keep updating "vi" and "vim") >> >> Why not make the default editor a nice simple one, like maybe pico, >> where the commands are shown. I can't see anyone using a command line >> editor for much else than a few simple changes, there are better simple >> editors in KDE and such. Damn that really pissed me off, and on top of >> that you guys changed from "vi" (same stupid geeky crap) to "vim" (worse >> geeky crap) in 7.1 did someone request this? I want to know who! >> >> Figure if someone is a big enough geek to want vim, let them spend their >> life away trying to figure it out (and how to change the default editor >> to do it). >> >> Thanks for the soapbox, I had my say (please forward this to whoever >> makes these program installation choices, if he's not a big geek that >> is). >> >> Sorry for the bandwith waste, had to get this off my chest. Anyone else >> feel like I do about this? >> >> > >You don't like vi? OK. It's your choice (thrust me, it's not mine! I >love this editor!). But if you are too subjective and lazy to realize that >it is one of the most powerfull text based editor available, then I think >that your default editor should be ... Notepad. > >-- > << There's no place like ~ ! >> > >Jean-Philippe Gois > e-systems - information technology > Av Jean Mermoz 22 > B-6041 Gosselies, Belgium > tel +32 (0) 71 34 94 00 > > >