--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb <no_reply@...> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, blusc0ut <no_reply@> wrote: > > > > What would you actually recommend to a person wanting to > > learn meditation? Do you recommend a book? Anything of > > Rama? > > Nothing from Rama, nothing from Maharishi. If I say > anything at all, it's to refer them to a couple of > groups I've run across that charge very little or > nothing and do absolutely nothing to rope the people > they teach into their organizations.
Okay, sounds sensible. > > I think you said that you wouldn't need to require > > personal instruction or an elaborated course. > > I think the most I've said on that subject may be > that I've learned valuable meditation techniques > sitting in a large room with a lot of people. They > worked fine. No discernible difference between them > and "personal instruction." I get you. I actually self-tested this form of initiation myself and found it working, but then I would not recommend the group as such. > > I sometimes meet people, and I cannot follow them up, > > they ask me for advise how to meditate. (I had this > > Russian lady driving to the airport yesterday). > > I tend to give them advice merely on what to look > for in the groups they investigate on their own, > and what to be wary of, and then tell them to > make their own decisions. Yeah, my idea as well. You have to see if they are gravitating towards Buddhism or more Hindu/Yoga related, Ramana Advaita / or Bhakti related. But in this case the person wanted just to learn how to meditate, not much ideas about anything yet, and a certain suspicion of religions. The moment I talk about my own past, and my development, people get interested, and I am stuck, as I don't want to sell them, with all due acknowledgement, my past practice. I ended up giving her a few online resources, about a secularized TM like approach, some pages with Japa / mantras, including bijas with sound-samples. Here is one link I send her: http://pentagonmeditationclub.org/transcending%20-%20%20quiet%20the%20mind.htm I also send her links to SSRS Sahaja Yoga, which in fact IS TM. > > I may even initiate somebody TM style again, after > > so many years, some friend asked me for it, so I > > guess I will probably do it, without money, org, > > and leaving all dogma aside. > > I would never do this, for many reasons. But you > are certainly welcome to, if you feel comfortable > doing so. I do, the only hassle is to relearn everything. But I want to do it without all the baggage and see how it goes. Then I know the person well, it's the girl friend of my best friend here. I teach, with all essential instructions in due place, tell them to try do it that way for some time, and if they feel they want to do it another way later, they have all the freedom. > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb <no_reply@> wrote: > > > > > > [ Caveat: What follows is my opinion, and in fact my > > > considered opinion, arrived at after decades of being > > > part of the TMO from the inside and observing it and > > > its members from the outside. You are well within your > > > rights to believe something else, because after all, it > > > is nothing BUT opinion. But so is what you believe. ] > > > > > > I figured that, on the heels of my "Echo Chamber Effect" > > > post, I should delineate some of the ways in which I > > > think TMers have, in fact, been indoctrinated to believe > > > certain things, disbelieve others, and adopt a funda- > > > mentalist defensive stance towards the former and an > > > offensive, "attack mode" stance towards the latter. > > > This is how I view the "TM Learning Process," after > > > having participated in it and observed it for 44 years: > > > > > > 1. You are taught to meditate, having been "pre-taught" > > > exactly what is going to happen when you meditate, and > > > how you "should" interpret what happens. Periods of > > > thought stopping are not "just" thought stopping; they > > > are "transcendence," merging with the Home Of All Know- > > > ledge, entering into a "higher" state of consciousness. > > > > > > 2. Your "innocent experience" of TM (which is anything > > > but) is then followed up by three nights of indoctrin- > > > ation into *more* of "what your experience 'really' > > > means and how to interpret it." You are told that not > > > only is each meditation an experience of some mystical > > > "universal field" of consciousness, doing it regularly > > > is your only real way to eventually experience an even > > > "higher" state of consciousness, enlightenment. You > > > are told what enlightenment "means," and told that it > > > is the "highest goal" anyone could ever aspire to. > > > > > > 3. In the three nights of checking, and every time you > > > walk into a TM center after that, you are encouraged > > > to "learn more." That is, you are encouraged to attend > > > hour after hour of lectures on -- essentially -- Hindu > > > thought and theories, "sanitized for your protection" > > > by describing them as "Vedic" thought. At no point are > > > any of these concepts presented *as* theories; they > > > are presented as Truth, the "highest knowledge" avail- > > > able on the planet. > > > > > > 4. After a few of these "advanced lectures, you are > > > encouraged to attend residence courses, during which > > > you "round" (meditate so often that you are considered > > > so spaced out and such a potential danger to yourself > > > and others that you are not allowed to leave the > > > facility in which the residence course is being held). > > > You are also forced to sit in front of TVs and watch > > > hours and hours of additional indoctrination on Hindu > > > thought and concepts, many of them delivered by > > > <genuflect> Maharishi Himself. > > > > > > 5. By putting "Maharishi Himself" in scare quotes, I > > > am hoping to capture the way that MMY is presented to > > > new students. That is, as the ultimate authority, an > > > enlightened being whose every word reflects the Truth > > > about the world and how it works. Even if it's not > > > expressed in words, the deference and sense of obeis- > > > ance that the TM teachers feel towards him is conveyed > > > subconsciously to the students, so much so that when > > > they first have an opportunity to meet him, they > > > cannot conceive of doing so except in the "accepted" > > > manner -- standing in a line and deferentially offer- > > > ing him a flower. By the time they actually do meet > > > him, they can no longer even conceive of *challenging* > > > any of the things he says; the lesson has been driven > > > home to them by this time that such behavior is > > > inappropriate and disrespectful. If Maharishi says > > > it, it's not only true, but Truth. > > > > > > 6. Then (at least in the past), if you want to "dive > > > further" into the TM "knowledge," you have to take SCI. > > > Which is basically the equivalent of being forced to > > > sit in front of hours and hours and hours of the most > > > boring and pretentious drivel you have ever seen on > > > television, while pretending that it isn't boring. > > > More indoctrination into "Just STFU and let the > > > waves of Ultimate Truth wash over you." > > > > > > 7. All along the way, TM is never once presented as > > > just another spiritual path; it is always presented > > > as The Best such path, the "highest path." The TM > > > teachers, in fact, respond to questions about other > > > paths (including the path taught by the real Shank- > > > aracharya tradition MMY comes from) by putting them > > > down, as they were taught to do on their TTCs. > > > > > > 8. Other sources of information about meditation or > > > the spiritual path are systematically put down and > > > demonized, and accessing them actually punished. I > > > have seen several people told that they were not > > > allowed to attend long residence courses or go TTC > > > because they had "the wrong kinds of books" on their > > > bookshelves, or admitting to having read such Off > > > The Program books. This is *still* being punished > > > in Fairfield and in other official TM locations as > > > those who dare to actually go see some other spiritual > > > teacher are declared heretics, and excommunicated. > > > The lesson being taught is simple and obvious -- > > > "Only *we* have the 'right' answers and interpret- > > > ations about spiritual practice; listening to anyone > > > else's answers or interpretations is dangerous for > > > you and will not be tolerated. > > > > > > 9. All along the way, subjective experience is > > > presented as tantamount to "proof." And this is done > > > while ignoring completely that almost all of the > > > interpretations *of* TMers' subjective experiences > > > were generated *after* having been indoctrinated > > > into what such experience "really mean." Think about > > > the ludicrous scene on IA courses, in which Maharishi > > > came up with a new buzzphrase experience, and the > > > next week dozens of people walk up to the microphone > > > to announce that they have "had" such experiences. > > > Pure programming, and by people who *don't even > > > realize* that they've been programmed. > > > > > > 10. Any criticism of TM, the TMO, and Maharishi is > > > characterized by TM teachers as an "attack," and > > > students are encouraged to view it as an attack on > > > *them* as well, and to respond to it with counter- > > > attack. The TMO "party line" when dealing with any > > > critic is to attempt to portray them as "having an > > > agenda" or "attempting to destroy what we all know > > > is the 'highest teaching.'" After seeing this > > > behavior modeled for them by the TMO as an organ- > > > ization and by TM teachers as a group, naturally > > > the students start to display this behavior, too. > > > > > > 11. The idea that there is a "right" way to describe > > > experiences during TM or spiritual concepts is drummed > > > into the students' heads, and punished by disfavor or > > > mockery if they dare to describe such things differ- > > > ently. Soon they start 'piling on' to other students > > > to mock them when they express things "wrongly." > > > > > > 12. The most far out, Woo Woo nonsense is presented > > > as if it's normal, and the people who believe in it > > > normal. Belief in astrology, the Woo Woo effects of > > > which side of your house the door is facing, or which > > > way your head faces when you sleep. Belief in siddhis > > > or "special powers" that no one has ever seen any > > > evidence of are presented as normal, and so often > > > that the people sitting in lecture halls sucking all > > > of this up come to believe that they *are* normal. > > > > > > 13. At some point, the siddhis are trotted out, at > > > the point when the students have been so thoroughly > > > taught to believe in Woo Woo as if it were normal > > > that they no longer react rationally when told that > > > they are going to learn how to FLY, ferchrissakes. > > > Rather than laugh, they buy into it, and plunk down > > > their money. Platitudes are told to them about how > > > they might not FLY through the air immediately, and > > > that they might spend a little time in the "first > > > stages of Yogic Flying," but it is always assumed > > > that Yes, someday they will really FLY. By this time, > > > the brainwashed dweebs in the audience actually buy > > > this. > > > > > > 14. Moving behind the closed walls of TM communities > > > starts to become encouraged. Despite the fact that > > > TM was first sold to them as a way to interface more > > > effectively *with* the world, moving *out* of the > > > world and into a TM Echo Chamber community is now > > > presented to them as the only way they can make > > > significant spiritual progress. > > > > > > 15. The road goes ever on. That is, just as in The > > > Hobbit, the goal constantly becomes further and further > > > away. Newer and "higher" states of consciousness or > > > abilities are announced, to attain which you must > > > attend such-and-such course and pay such-and-such > > > additional amount of money. Each one is presented as > > > "the course that will finally do it for you," and by > > > this time the indoctrination is so ingrained that no > > > one notices when it isn't, or remembers when the next > > > such course is announced that the previous one did > > > nothing for them except drain their bank accounts. > > > > > > I could go on and on, but I suspect that anyone whose > > > mind is still open enough to have read this far gets > > > the point. There is one enormous SHITLOAD of indoc- > > > trination in the way that TM is taught. My contention > > > is that this indoctrination has gone on for so long, > > > and has been tolerated (if not embraced) by many on > > > this forum for so long that they are actually in > > > denial that it ever took place. > > > > > > But it did. And that's why you believe the things > > > that you do. It's NOT that they are inherently true, > > > or Truth. It's that you have been told they are, > > > and you bought it hook, line, and sinker. > > > > > > It's fine to continue to believe that they are, but > > > shouldn't you at least be willing to admit that the > > > reason you believe the things you believe is that > > > you've been *told* to believe them, systematically, > > > for decades? If you can't, in my view that charac- > > > terizes you as not only a fundamentalist, but a > > > fundamentalist in denial. > > > > > >
