Actually, Doc, after MIU moved to FF, Maharishi visited and during Q&A, a townsperson asked if TM is a religion. Maharishi responded that religious people will see it as a religion; scientists will see it as a science. I think he also said that business people will see it as a business and educators will see it as a method of education.
On Wednesday, January 15, 2014 11:20 AM, "doctordumb...@rocketmail.com" <doctordumb...@rocketmail.com> wrote: How could TM possibly be a religion?? It is, after all, a technique which leads to fulfillment, of the goals, of ALL the religions, IF one is willing to put in the hard work, and dedication necessary. Fear and bitterness are all I see as the drivers of this stupidity [equating TM to religion]. It is like referring to a kitchen knife as "a murder weapon", when all it is used for, in real life, is chopping carrots. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote: Thanks, Turqb. Nice substantial writing even as I can't agree with you I do appreciate the thought. Almost missed your post for all the personal ankel-biting macros that get posted here. -Buck ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <turquoiseb@...> wrote: > > >--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson wrote: > >> >>> of course they are lying about it - that's their stock in trade >> >>The sadder reality, Michael, one that you may not be aware of from personal >>experience (or may...that is for you to say) is that they *aren't* lying. >>Except to themselves. > >One of the aspects of the disciple mindset (or cult mindset if you prefer) is >that people who have bought into a shitload of dogma laid on them by teachers >they now revere almost as infallible and as near-gods (think MMY) have an >incredible way of *just never thinking about* anything that contradicts that >dogma. They stuff any contradictions or cognitive dissonance away back in a >corner of their minds -- literally "out of sight, out of mind." > >So technically many of these people are *not* lying -- consciously -- when >they say that TM is not a religion, often only a couple of hours after leaving >a "celebration" at MUM in which they chanted and made offerings to Hindu gods. >They push the dogma they've been told to repeat -- and which they desperately >*need* to be true to keep up their allegiance to this org/cause they've been >told is so important -- and they just hide the cognitive dissonance away in >the back of their minds and never acknowledge it. > >I have sadly been there, done that. Both in the TMO and in the Rama trip, so I >know it's not only possible, but probable for *most* of the TM Teachers >repeating the "TM is not a religion" meme they've been taught to repeat. I >myself repeated the "TM is 100% life-supporting and cannot possibly have any >negative characteristics" even *while* assigned to the "Twitching Group" in >Fiuggi, surrounded by dozens of people like myself experiencing non-stop jerks >and spasms and symptoms that looked for all the world like a viral outbreak of >Tourette's Syndrome. It took *years* -- after hearing of a number of suicides >and seeing people wind up in mental hospitals after long TM courses -- before >I became open enough to recognize that I'd been lying to myself, and thus to >others. I *wanted* to believe the "no negative side effects" meme, so I >managed to blot out recognition and acknowledgement of anything that suggested >it wasn't true. > >I would suspect that many of the people still clinging to the "TM is not a >religion" meme are doing the same thing. A few may indeed be consciously aware >of the reality and be lying about it, but my bet is that many are still so >stuck in the cult mindset that they feel they *have* to believe what they were >told to believe, and *have* to repeat it every time the question comes up. > >Yes, it boggles the mind, but that is the nature of the cult mindset. People >who had to learn and memorize the English translation of the TM puja and "hold >it lively in their minds" every time they chanted the Sanskrit version of it >will look you straight in the eyes and call it a "non-religious, traditional >ceremony." *Some* part of them knows that they're lying, but it's a part they >can never admit into their conscious awareness. > >It's really weird, but it happens every day, in pretty much every religion, >spiritual organization, and cult in the world. It even happens in business. I >remember a documentary about activists who were tried in court for staging a >demonstration at a General Electric plant back in (I think) the 60s. The >screenplay was largely drawn from transcripts of the actual trials, and thus >the under-oath testimony of workers at the plant, *dozens* of whom claimed >that they didn't know what they were building in that GE plant. "We just >worked there," they all said, claiming that they had no idea that they were >working in the largest manufacturing facility for atomic weapons in the world. >Every morning they walked in through a main entrance hall in which was >prominently displayed the nosecone of an Atlas missile, and yet they claimed >that they didn't know what they were building megadeath every day on their >assembly lines. > >Go figure. That's the cult mindset for you -- protect the myths, protect the >memes, protect the image of the group that pays you or that you owe allegiance >to, hide your own everyday lies by hiding the truth even from yourself, way >down deep in parts of your mind that you never allow to surface. That's what I >think is going on when any TM Teacher these days claims that the TMO is not a >religious organization. They're not necessarily lying to you; they're lying to >themselves. > > >> -------------------------------------------- >>> On Wed, 1/15/14, anartaxius@... anartaxius@... wrote: >>> >>> Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Apostasy, is a terrible thing. >>> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com >>> Date: Wednesday, January 15, 2014, 4:58 AM >>> >>> 'Apostasy is the >>> formal disaffiliation from or abandonment or renunciation of >>> a religion by a person. One who commits apostasy is known as >>> an apostate.' >>> As I never was the member of >>> any religion, I cannot ever be correctly accused of >>> apostasy. As the TM org claims it is not a religion, so no >>> one can ever be correctly accused for disafilliating or >>> abandoning TM as apostasy (unless of course the TM org is >>> lying about that claim). >> >>
