http://ibc.hbw.com/ibc/phtml/votacio.phtml?idVideo=3621&tipus=1
Here is a link to a short video which provides a small inkling of the "drafting" behaviour or frigatebirds. It isn't a long enough video to know if the alignment there was more than accidental, nor does it show more than two in alignment, but it's a start. Thanks for the suggestion about contacting bird-watchers in frigatebird territory for a work-around, I'll look into it. Hugh ----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Henshaw" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "'The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group'" <friam@redfish.com> Sent: Saturday, January 06, 2007 9:28 PM Subject: Re: [FRIAM] observations of complex phenomena while in Mexico I'll be glad to see what further patterns you find. Just to clarify, my suggestion was not just that the two colonies were different, but that the variation in local colony behavior might be as great as the variation in local environments where colonies are found. If you were to make observations randomly across the range of the species you'd get a better sense of what behaviors are universal and what are local. What you'd want is a work-around, of course, that would be a little less work. Perhaps you could try getting a list of bird watchers in the frigatebird range and randomly calling them to see what they have to say. As to the generality of a "drafting principle", there is at least one major example of it I've given a good bit of study, the formation and evolution of air currents. If you want an example of the vast creativity of local physical processes you might do well to give them a little look. Do all the modeling you like and none of it will produce the degree of intricate and inventive complexity you find in the pathway negotiations taking place around any even mildly warm body like, for example, the one sitting in front of your computer screen right now! Phil Henshaw ¸¸¸¸.·´ ¯ `·.¸¸¸¸ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 680 Ft. Washington Ave NY NY 10040 tel: 212-795-4844 e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] explorations: www.synapse9.com > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Hugh Trenchard > Sent: Saturday, January 06, 2007 7:16 PM > To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group > Subject: Re: [FRIAM] observations of complex phenomena while in Mexico > > > Thanks for all your comments. Next time I'm in Mexico, I will > definitely do > my best to get some video footage. My recollection of what I > saw in October > 2005 in Mazatlan is that the various yaws and compensations > were easy to > see, as you say. I can't remember how long the formations > were stable - > perhaps generally less than a minute, before the formation > would break down > (but I'm really just guessing) - but they were long enough to see the > dynamics involved. And after the formations broke down, they > would often > reform again fairly soon. > > Regarding Phil's comment that the Mazatlan colonies were > possibly just > different from the Cancun colonies I will need to investigate that. > (Frank - I was in Cancun over Christmas, by the way and the > migration habits > might be a factor involved in when and why they engage in vee > formation - > something else to investigate). It seems, though, it is > unlikely that a > single colony in Mazatlan would have developed the vee > formation capacity > completely independently of a colony in Cancun, especially > when the distance > between them is not really that great when we think in terms of bird > migratory habits. So far, I still think the wind conditions > are more likely > what prevented vee formation in Cancun, but of course I will > need a bit more > evidence to support that. > > Also, Phil, I would argue that strong leadership is not a > factor in vee > formations. As we all know, self-organized phenomena arise > without leaders > to guide the emergent patterns - I can't think of why it would be any > different for frigatebirds. The formations must self-organize > from some > principle of interaction - in the case of organisms that save > energy by > drafting, it is the coupling between them that occurs because > there is a > physiological or energetic advantage to their coupling (ie. to their > drafting). > > It could be that frigatebird vee formations are simply > derived from their > inherent natural behaviours and have no basis in any > underlying physical > principles, but given the advantages conferred upon other > types of organisms > that engage in drafting dynamics and formations, it seems > reasonable to ask > if there is there is a physical principle underlying the formations. > > Nonetheless, what this all suggests to me that it is an area ripe for > further study, and that very little work has been done to > establish the > universality of the "drafting principle" as I am calling it. > I actually > think it applies in a lot of other situations as well, from > trail formation > to aspects of economics, but that's little more than a gut > feeling at this > point. But I suppose, at the very least, until I can get > some good footage > of frigatebird formations and some wind speed measurements, > we can only > speculate as to what is happening with them. > > I'm not sure when I'll be in Mexico next, but I'll keep > everyone posted as > to what I see. If anyone else is going, please keep an eye > out for the > frigatebirds! Pelicans also fly in vees too, but they are > more like geese, > I think - they fly past at fairly high speed. > > On the note about the decline of traveling geese, I really > can't speculate. > I live on the west coast of Canada in British Columbia and I > still see vee > formations going in all directions. But perhaps global > warming is a factor > in the distances they need to fly now - maybe they can stay > farther north > all year round. > > Hugh Trenchard > > ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org
