Oh, forgot to clearly identify the irony: ;-) Doing diligence on this crap is way exhausting. I am entirely in sympathy with your dilemma.
Even if ivermectin does nothing useful, it still may be a useful treatment in situations where no other treatment is available. And fabricating evidence of its efficacy would also be a comfort to the patients and the medical staff in that situation. A placebo can be better than nothing, a placebo with a bogus story behind it can be even better. -- rec -- -- rec -- On Sun, Aug 15, 2021 at 12:37 PM Roger Critchlow <r...@elf.org> wrote: > Pieter -- > > I looked over the links you listed. > > They seem to claim that withdrawl of ivermectin caused the spike in Covid > cases in India, and also that administering ivermectin caused the end of > the spike in Covid cases. Both of these claims are sort of hard to > evaluate, since I don't see any evidence that anyone has ever distributed > ivermectin/doxycycline/zinc kits very widely, either before or after the > spike in infections. Constructing and delivering kits for 1.366 billion > people would have been quite an achievement for any economy. > > I followed the links to https://c19ivermectin.com/ and found the list of > ivermectin studies. The list presented currently claims 110 studies, 68 > peer reviewed, 64 involving control and treatment groups, but it's puffed > up with another 50 entries which are news clippings, press releases, > meta-analyses, reviews, and other miscellanea. > > I looked an early review article, > https://www.nature.com/articles/s41429-020-0336-z.pdf, though the pdf is > hosted at nature.com, it's from a different journal. > > The Journal of Antibiotics (2020) 73:593–602 >> https://doi.org/10.1038/s41429-020-0336-z >> Ivermectin: a systematic review from antiviral effects to COVID-19 >> complementary regimen Fatemeh Heidary1 ● Reza Gharebaghi2,3 >> 1 Head of Ophthalmology Division, Taleghani Hospital, Ahvaz Jundishapur >> University of Medical Sciences, Ahvaz, Iran >> 2 Kish International Campus, University of Tehran, Tehran, Iran >> 3 International Virtual Ophthalmic Research Center (IVORC), Austin, TX, >> USA >> Abstract >> Ivermectin proposes many potentials effects to treat a range of diseases, >> with its antimicrobial, antiviral, and anti-cancer properties as a wonder >> drug. It is highly effective against many microorganisms including some >> viruses. In this comprehensive systematic review, antiviral effects of >> ivermectin are summarized including in vitro and in vivo studies over the >> past 50 years. Several studies reported antiviral effects of ivermectin on >> RNA viruses such as Zika, dengue, yellow fever, West Nile, Hendra, >> Newcastle, Venezuelan equine encephalitis, chikungunya, Semliki Forest, >> Sindbis, Avian influenza A, Porcine Reproductive and Respiratory Syndrome, >> Human immunodeficiency virus type 1, and severe acute respiratory syndrome >> coronavirus 2. Furthermore, there are some studies showing antiviral >> effects of ivermectin against DNA viruses such as Equine herpes type 1, BK >> polyomavirus, pseudorabies, porcine circovirus 2, and bovine herpesvirus 1. >> Ivermmust beectin plays a role in several biological mechanisms, therefore >> it could serve as a potential candidate in the treatment of a wide range of >> viruses including COVID-19 as well as other types of positive-sense >> single-stranded RNA viruses. In vivo studies of animal models revealed a >> broad range of antiviral effects of ivermectin, however, clinical trials >> are necessary to appraise the potential efficacy of ivermectin in clinical >> setting >> > > The quick read is that ivermectin interferes with viral reproduction *in > vitro*, but fails to work *in vivo*, for all of these viruses. It's been > tried against every virus that's turned up in the last 50 years, had some *in > vitro* anti-viral activity, but never became an approved treatment for > any of them. > > It must be that the elites are consipring. That's the only reasonable > explanation for the facts. > > -- rec -- > > On Sun, Aug 15, 2021 at 2:28 AM Pieter Steenekamp < > piet...@randcontrols.co.za> wrote: > >> Nick, >> >> Thanks for pointing out that my message is not very clear. Let me rewrite >> it with a change in wording, I hope it's better this time. >> >> I believe that the study that Marcus referred to above , >> https://www.latimes.com/business/story/2021-08-11/ivermectin-no-effect-covid >> , >> is most probably correct. >> >> Help me if I'm wrong. It proves that according to a specific protocol, >> there are no benefits against covid in using ivermectin. Does that mean >> that there are no other prophylaxis protocols that include ivermectin that >> do give benefits? >> >> I'd like to make sense of what's happening in India. According to some >> (see references below), the use of ivermectin is effective against covid in >> India. I really don't know how reliable these sources are. Does anyone have >> better information? I'd like to know. >> >> References: >> https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/india/ >> >> >> https://assets.researchsquare.com/files/rs-208785/v1/d6ff79a3-d354-4aba-a6b0-4bc123bbd225.pdf >> >> >> https://stuartbramhall.wordpress.com/2021/04/29/when-india-stopped-prescribing-ivermectin-and-started-vaccinating-deaths-shot-up/ >> >> >> https://nonvenipacem.com/2021/07/31/india-crushed-covid-using-ivermectin-and-you-can-too/ >> >> >> https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2021/05/elites-worried-covid-cases-india-plummet-government-promotes-ivermectin-hydroxychloroquine-use/ >> >> Pieter >> >> >> >> On Sat, 14 Aug 2021 at 23:13, <thompnicks...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Pieter >>> >>> >>> >>> Did you perhaps leave out a link? Which study? >>> >>> >>> >>> Nick Thompson >>> >>> thompnicks...@gmail.com >>> >>> https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ >>> >>> >>> >>> *From:* Friam <friam-boun...@redfish.com> *On Behalf Of *Pieter >>> Steenekamp >>> *Sent:* Saturday, August 14, 2021 12:09 PM >>> *To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group < >>> friam@redfish.com> >>> *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] ivermectin, nope >>> >>> >>> >>> I believe this study is most probably correct. >>> >>> Help me if I'm wrong. It proves that according to a specific protocol, >>> there are no benefits against covid in using ivermectin. Does that mean >>> that there are no other prophylaxis protocols that include ivermectin that >>> do give benefits? >>> >>> I'd like to make sense of what's happening in India. According to some >>> (see reference below), the use of ivermectin is effective against covid in >>> India. I really don't know how reliable these sources are. Does anyone have >>> better information? I'd like to know. >>> >>> References: >>> >>> https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/india/ >>> >>> https://assets.researchsquare.com/files/rs-208785/v1/d6ff79a3-d354-4aba-a6b0-4bc123bbd225.pdf >>> >>> https://stuartbramhall.wordpress.com/2021/04/29/when-india-stopped-prescribing-ivermectin-and-started-vaccinating-deaths-shot-up/ >>> >>> >>> https://nonvenipacem.com/2021/07/31/india-crushed-covid-using-ivermectin-and-you-can-too/ >>> >>> >>> https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2021/05/elites-worried-covid-cases-india-plummet-government-promotes-ivermectin-hydroxychloroquine-use/ >>> >>> >>> >>> Pieter >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Sat, 14 Aug 2021 at 17:34, Marcus Daniels <mar...@snoutfarm.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> https://www.latimes.com/business/story/2021-08-11/ivermectin-no-effect-covid >>> >>> - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . >>> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv >>> Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam >>> un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com >>> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ >>> archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ >>> >>> - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . >>> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv >>> Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam >>> un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com >>> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ >>> archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ >>> >> - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . >> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv >> Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam >> un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com >> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ >> archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ >> >
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