Well, OK. I'd quibble with your use of "necessary". It may be extremely likely to continue happening. But there's probably a just-so world where it doesn't have to happen. Whatever, though. The point is that the lefty objectives aren't vague in any significant sense. It's the bad faith gaming by the righties that try to argue they're vague. Treat them like trolls on the internet. Either trash 'em with the same debunk every time they pop up; or simply ignore them and move ahead with the project. Essentially, I agree. Engagement with their rhetoric doesn't do us much good, even if *I* personally enjoy it.
On 7/1/22 12:38, Marcus Daniels wrote:
It may be necessary to let children be shot in schools. There are so many people that are so afraid that Gates or Fauci or Soros (someone?) will tell them how to live, or because they fear the rage of the black man, etc. that they invest a significant fraction of their income into weapons and ammunition. I don't see any reasoning with these people. Something deep in their amygdala is wired wrong. -----Original Message----- From: Friam <friam-boun...@redfish.com> On Behalf Of glen Sent: Friday, July 1, 2022 11:04 AM To: friam@redfish.com Subject: Re: [FRIAM] self-care IDK. That just sounds like laziness to me. "The West" is a fiction. We all know that. And it's irrelevant to the values aspired to by Egalitarianism or "Western Enlightenment", anyway. The actual trouble is that the egalitarians strawman each other and allow non-egalitarians to strawman them. A good example is the (false) identification of "equal" with "equality" or "equal opportunity" or whatever persnickety nonsense token the bullshitters poke at. The core ideas come from positive and negative freedoms. Freedom from being mugged when you walk down the street or being shot by an incel while studying math, polluted cities and rivers, etc. Freedom to buy a house, sell your kidney, ride your enduro through pristine forest, etc. There's no "wondering" there. There's no lack of concreteness there. Children shouldn't be shot in schools. That's pretty concrete. Adults should be able to trace campaign contributions. That's concrete. It's all clear and fairly well laid out. The strawmanny pretense that it's vague is part of their rhetorical game. And "we" let rhetoriticians like Thiel bullshit us all day every day. I found this essay helpful: Why I am not a liberal https://sootyempiric.blogspot.com/2022/04/why-i-am-not-liberal.html On 7/1/22 09:32, Marcus Daniels wrote:Thiel's apparent solution, the dissolution of the administrative state has some in common with the urging to remove the filibuster. End paralysis and force engagement. The goals for the thinkers on the side of the Handmaid's tale or Al-Qaeda are texts that are not too long or complicated to convey. What are the concrete goals for the liberal agenda, other than to constantly negotiate and atomize? He does have a point of wondering what the West is fighting for, other than to be taken care of. -----Original Message----- From: Friam <friam-boun...@redfish.com> On Behalf Of glen Sent: Friday, July 1, 2022 8:45 AM To: friam@redfish.com Subject: Re: [FRIAM] self-care It may come as a surprise that I agree. >8^D There will be no *widespread* Enlightenment. We're limited to a mind-oligopoly. Whereas the intelligentsia of the right lean toward a philosopher dictator (e.g. Thiel's "Straussian Moment"), I lean toward a maximally sized thinking class. My inspiration is (up to my ignorance) biological. We specialize everything into niches. Why not specialize thought as well? Clearly, some of us are better at it than others. The task, here, is to build an aggressive thinking class which rests on peri-altrustic values. What those values are and how they evolve is above my pay grade. But they are similar to those often attributed to the Enlightenment project (equivalence classes, freedom, do no harm, progress, justified true belief, etc.). And then pit that class against those who desire a singular benevolent dictator. And that *war*, between those two groups of thinkers might be able to proceed with minimal suffering on the part of the non-thinkers, preferably through words and soft power as opposed to fire and blood. But if "our" cognitively powerful people don't step up and take on the duty to out-think "their" cognitively powerful people, then you're right. Fire and blood it will be. On 7/1/22 08:29, Marcus Daniels wrote:I guess it will come as no surprise I think there will be no Enlightenment. There will be no civil debate. A culture war is a war, and winning a war requires cruelty. That's why the other side is winning. They have their preferences, and they are pursuing them. Liberals degenerate to too much reflection and inaction. It's not going to be a win-win. -----Original Message----- From: Friam <friam-boun...@redfish.com> On Behalf Of ? glen Sent: Friday, July 1, 2022 1:35 AM To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <friam@redfish.com> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] self-care The time for organized response has long passed. Voting Dem won't help much because of the antidemocratic senate, electoral college, and scotus. But we do have some tactical responses in place like the ACLU and such. They're just not strategic enough. The depth of organization on the right seems to outstrip that of the left, despite the superficial distraction of the altright neoreactionaries and empty-headed 'deplorables'. Orgs like the Federalists have been planning and strategizing for decades while the Enlightenment project languishes in neglect. Those of us NOT actively working on the "how we do that" part bear as much blame for the cruelty as the cruel, themselves. I'm as guilty as any dork, finding it much easier to plunge my head into the sand that is my tiny, largely irrelevant subdomain where I'm warm and comfy. But the dorks need to pull their heads out and work strategically on the political problem staring us in the face. Getting to THAT shared value is a prerequsite to an effective long term strategy. On June 30, 2022 9:33:34 PM PDT, Marcus Daniels <mar...@snoutfarm.com> wrote:First, a nap! https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abn0853 On Jun 30, 2022, at 5:56 PM, Frank Wimberly <wimber...@gmail.com> wrote: I'm hoping that there is an overwhelming response by young people to vote Democrat in the upcoming elections. Traditionally young people haven't voted in the numbers you'd expect. --- Frank C. Wimberly 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, Santa Fe, NM 87505 505 670-9918 Santa Fe, NM On Thu, Jun 30, 2022, 6:41 PM David Eric Smith <desm...@santafe.edu<mailto:desm...@santafe.edu>> wrote: Yeah, the theme of performative cruelty as a social movement has now fully found and asserted its identity. I wonder when the rest of us decide this is enough of a threat to need an organized response, and how we do that. Eric On Jul 1, 2022, at 8:17 AM, Roger Critchlow <r...@elf.org<mailto:r...@elf.org>> wrote: And they're discussing how to adapt the Texas bounty hunter law for catching people who cross state lines for forbidden practices. -- rec -- On Thu, Jun 30, 2022 at 3:12 PM Marcus Daniels <mar...@snoutfarm.com<mailto:mar...@snoutfarm.com>> wrote: I can see it now. Netflix and others won't let me watch when I'm a VPN. When folks ask the AI bot for contingencies for their self-administered medical procedures like this, only those on the coasts will get answers, whereas the s**thole states will require these services be blocked. -----Original Message----- From: Friam <friam-boun...@redfish.com<mailto:friam-boun...@redfish.com>> On Behalf Of glen Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2022 8:22 AM To: friam@redfish.com<mailto:friam@redfish.com> Subject: [FRIAM] self-care In the aftermath of the activist Justices overturning RvW, this popped up in my feed: How to Give Yourself an Abortion https://jewishcurrents.org/how-to-give-yourself-an-abortion<https:// l inkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fjewishcurrents.org%2fhow- t o-give-yourself-an-abortion&c=E,1,-Zhst6g-QuPY81edlf5guSgQZYWNBDtKv- d Bpsl270nvAgGGtae69BEi6B5aBys3TXw8Qrfjnw9C54JCGo7OUuFmFQpqvGQdE4H0Opb w hUY120PDbMU,&typo=1> I remain torn on the issue of self-care. And lots of energy was added to my oscillators with the whole "horse dewormer" thing for COVID-19. (Yes, I'm poking fun both at the people who bought veterinary ivermectin and the people who used the disgusting sneer "horse dewormer".) To boot, this post came up this morning about a homeopathic packet sent home with the patient after surgery: https://centerforinquiry.salsalabs.org/2022cfimidyearemailversion11< h ttps://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fcenterforinquiry. s alsalabs.org%2f2022cfimidyearemailversion11&c=E,1,2-tYnySplBvRbyAEZY 0 KK5_SNRCghwoq9MmOb6g5eMt9G2A_oGrBmm9E1TaU7yvGTUKGOPabsgE4XOSxdStdMKc x T0twCXUSsGHdzEdo&typo=1>. (Placebo is a thing, despite Blumner's write-off.) Nick is fond of asking people whether they take multivitamins or not. And while it's true most experts claim that *healthy* people just pee them out. *Who* amongst us actually qualifies as "healthy"? What does "health" even mean? That's not an idle or rhetorical question. Am I "healthy", despite the excruciating chronic pain in my shoulders, neck, and lower back? Despite my sporadic debilitating migraines? Despite my now abated follicular lymphoma? Sure, I *seem* healthy because I can do pull-ups, shovel dirt, drink 5 pints without a hangover, and maintain a full-time job with a bit of time for hobbies. But what you see from the outside doesn't reflect what I feel on the inside, which is like a sick puppy where the slightest bad event would topple me into the "disabled" category. "Healthy" is at best a misinformation concept, at worst a malinformation concept: https://www.cisa.gov/sites/default/files/publications/mdm-incident-r e sponse-guide_508.pdf<https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a% 2 f%2fwww.cisa.gov%2fsites%2fdefault%2ffiles%2fpublications%2fmdm-inci d ent-response-guide_508.pdf&c=E,1,Ef-lWkoDnJgtSZ-J-K2J__Wq3myHESDDO7F O gc7aBf48epSTTibefBKrHiCBz7IkvQMKq_jRU9CmI-tNPXyTpwFzlorlRHmoGOhnyCjN Z IFl-1kNK5Uos08,&typo=1> Sneer all you want at the new-age descendant reading self-help books, cutting out magazine ads for their "vision board", or self-administering veterinary de-fetus pills, but there's something important, here. Fad diets, bottled water, alcoholism or pregnancy as an indicator for moral failure, etc. all point at that thing, whatever that thing is. In that context, self-administered abortion is legit.
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