My God, you made me think about something I haven't thought about in years.  I 
think??? that I use to to to.. or maybe two two two :)  Actually I do think I 
use to to and tu tu tu.  The thing I DON'T do...  and I know some are an 
advocate of this...  is to put a t at the end of the tonguing.  Like tut tut 
tut.  If you are really trying to do very rapid single tonguing, then I suppose 
the tut tut is kind of natural.  Maybe????
 
Milton

Milton Kicklighter
4th Horn Buffalo Philharmonic
Retired




________________________________
From: William Bard <[email protected]>
To: The Horn List <[email protected]>
Sent: Mon, June 27, 2011 3:54:16 PM
Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Articulation and 'airy' sound issues

Milton, I'll try it out. So, for tonguing, do you personally use a "Ta" or 
"Tee" 
type syllable with your tongue, or more of a "Thu?" I've heard of both but am 
always curious to hear people's preferences. Band directors while I was in 
middle school and high school always told me "Ta" and I've heard varying ideas 
form horn players.

-Bill Bard

On Jun 27, 2011, at 3:08 PM, Milton Kicklighter wrote:

> Bill, what happened to me was this:  I was doing a lot of mouthpiece 
> buzzing... 
>
> which I have always done and still do... but had let the tip of my tongue 
> move 

> up from the very the bottom of my mouth to right behind my teeth.  I had 
> done this so gradually that I did not notice the change.  But it had a major 
> change on my horn sound.  
> 
> 
> Try this:  buzz on your mouthpiece and gradually move your tongue up behind 
>your 
>
> teeth and then back down into your mouth.  You should notice a radical change 
>in 
>
> the sound of the buzz.  
> 
>  
> Milton
> 
> Milton Kicklighter
> 4th Horn Buffalo Philharmonic
> Retired
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________
> From: William Bard <[email protected]>
> To: The Horn List <[email protected]>
> Sent: Mon, June 27, 2011 1:42:53 PM
> Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Articulation and 'airy' sound issues
> 
> I think the position of the tongue is likely a big factor in this. Some days, 
>my 
>
> tonguing feels great and the easiest thing in the world, and other days it 
>feels 
>
> like a rock that I'm having to lug back and forth in my mouth. Not easy at 
> all. 
>
> I'm hoping this will clear up during college and in the years after, as I 
> gain 

> more consistency. I can buzz without the mouthpiece, but I have a VERY tough 
> time doing so. It's difficult to actually create pitches I want, without the 
> mouthpiece. 
> 
> 
> -William Bard
> 
> On Jun 27, 2011, at 1:35 PM, Milton Kicklighter wrote:
> 
>> Don't forget the position of the tongue when you are playing.  I got into 
>> real 
>
> 
>> trouble a few years back not paying attention to the position of the tongue 
>> when 
>> 
>> I was playing.  Years ago I found that leaking air for me was to much 
>> pressure 
>
> 
>> and not enough muscle control.  Can you form a embouchure and buzz without 
>> the 
>
> 
>> mouthpiece?  Or do you pinch your lips together when you try to buzz? 
>> 
>>  
>> Milton
>> 
>> Milton Kicklighter
>> 4th Horn Buffalo Philharmonic
>> Retired
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ________________________________
>> From: William Bard <[email protected]>
>> To: The Horn List <[email protected]>
>> Sent: Mon, June 27, 2011 1:05:44 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Articulation and 'airy' sound issues
>> 
>> The edges are closed tightly, yes. And thanks for the suggestion about the 
>> Italian language! I'll definitely look into that. Thanks.
>> 
>> -William Bard
>> 
>> On Jun 27, 2011, at 12:52 AM, Hans Pizka wrote:
>> 
>>> William, are the edges of your lips (embouchure) closed tightly, so air 
>>> cannot 
>>
>> 
>>> escape there ???
>>> Next, do not use that much air. Do not blow air into the horn actively. 
>>> Better, 
>>>
>>> 
>>> just release air
>>> according to pitch, dynamic etc.
>>> Third, study Italian language, to learn about clear vowels, absolutely 
>>> clear 

>>> vowels, and clear consonants. You will wonder, how that would improve your 
>>> playing, special tongue action.
>>> 
>>> Good luck !
>>> #################################################
>>> Am 27.06.2011 um 04:38 schrieb William Bard:
>>> 
>>>> I've been playing the horn some seven years, having just graduated high 
>>>> school, 
>>>>
>>>> 
>>>> and I will begin attending the Eastman School of Music this fall for a 
>>>> degree 
>>
>>>> in 
>>>> 
>>>> Horn Performance. However, before I get up there and start school, I 
>>>> really 

>>>> thought I should ask the members of this board for some advice on an issue 
>>>> (I 
>>
>> 
>>>> think it's an issue...) I've been noticing lately in my playing.
>>>> 
>>>> Back in February I had a lesson with Rick Solis out in Cleveland, and he 
>>>> pointed out that often times, when I articulate, it sounds almost as 
>>>> though the 
>>>>
>>>> 
>>>> tongue is rebounding, or something is happening to make the tonguing not 
>>>> quite 
>>>
>>> 
>>>> so clear and more blatty sounding. I've especially noticed this when I 
>>>> play 

>>>> loud 
>>>> 
>>>> or technically difficult passages. 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> He and Rich King both pointed out to me in my audition for the Cleveland 
>>>> Institute of Music that it was something I really have to work on and fix 
>>>> over 
>>>
>>> 
>>>> the next few years; otherwise it could spell big problems for my playing. 
>>>> They 
>>>
>>> 
>>>> said it will "hopefully go away" over time, but this still really worries 
> me.
>>>> 
>>>> In addition, I can't help but notice an extra sort of buzz to my sound, 
>>>> when I 
>>>
>>> 
>>>> play. At times, it is even very airy sounding. I can't figure out yet if 
>>>> this 
>>
>>>> is 
>>>> 
>>>> my horn that is vibrating ever so slightly along with the pitches I'm 
>>>> playing, 
>>>
>>> 
>>>> or if this is an internal sound that I'm hearing as the note vibrates 
>>>> through 
>>
>>>> my 
>>>> 
>>>> mouth and possibly through my teeth, or what the heck this is. 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Obviously, when I take the horn away and buzz on the mouthpiece, it's not 
>>>> just 
>>>
>>> 
>>>> the sound of the note I hear, as I can also hear the air flow moving 
>>>> through 
>
>>>> the 
>>>> 
>>>> mouthpiece. Is tongue placement or something else possibly amplifying the 
>>>> airflow or sound of my buzz, so that it becomes noticeable IN ADDITION to 
>>>> the 
>>
>> 
>>>> sound of the horn, itself? 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Does anyone have any suggestions or advice regarding this? Or, 
>>>> furthermore, is 
>>>
>>> 
>>>> this truly an issue, or is it actually somewhat normal? This is really 
>>>> puzzling 
>>>>
>>>> 
>>>> to me and I really hope to get it figured out before it's too late! Thanks 
>>>> so 
>>
>> 
>>>> much.
>>>> 
>>>> -William Bard
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> post: [email protected]
>>>> unsubscribe or set options at 
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>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
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>> 
>> _______________________________________________
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>>m
>> m
>> _______________________________________________
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> 
> _______________________________________________
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>m
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