My feelings exactly!!! ORBS had my organization on "the list" too. I only
found out because one of my users who has a Bignet account could not receive
mail from my domain. I only had to change the relay option on the Imail,
but it would have been nice to get some kind of warning.
Samantha
Macomb Intermediate Schools
Macomb, Michigan
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Friday, February 09, 2001 2:43 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: RE: [IMail Forum] ORBS problems
>
>
>
> What's wrong with ORBs? Let me tell you a story.
>
> Before we switched to Imail, we were running NTMail, and yes,
> some of our
> domains were
> listed. This is because the version of NTMail we were running couldn't
> effectively
> *not* relay, and to upgrade to a version that could? 8 grand.
>
> So all of a sudden customers who don't dial up through us
> can't send mail
> through their
> mail servers; no warning, no explanation. We later found out
> that Earthlink
> (their dialup
> provider) was using ORBs to block port 25 on their routers. oops. This
> costed us a few
> customers before we figured it out. We looked all the wrong
> places, simply
> because no one
> bothered to tell us we were listed, and Earthlink was
> certainly no help.
>
> Beyond what they've done to us directly, I have some
> fundamental rights
> issues with them:
> 1. Who are they to tell me if I can relay or not? Of course,
> we don't, but
> that isn't the point. There
> are legitimate reasons to do it, and as the story above
> illustrated, that
> can have a very real
> effect on other parts of our business. In short, it has a
> chilling effect.
>
> 2. ORBs subscribers use the list in ways they may not have intended.
> Earthlink uses it to block
> all traffic from a "relay" site.
>
> 3. ORBs incorrectly listed one of our IPs as an open relay,
> when it was not.
> Further, there was
> no notice that the address was listed, and certainly no
> warning that "we
> will list you if you
> don't turn of relaying". At the very least, affected parties
> should be given
> warning and an
> opportunity to correct if they so chose, or tell them kiss
> off if they so
> choose.
>
> 4. Now we have to proactively track if any of our blocks are
> listed so we
> don't get blindsided again.
> One more daily task we should not have to do.
>
> I guess it just comes down to that I don't appreciate yet
> another entity
> telling me what
> I can and cannot do.
>
> *rant ends*
>
> Jon
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Scott Perry
> Sent: Friday, February 09, 2001 7:13 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: RE: [IMail Forum] ORBS problems
>
>
> >Orbs blows.
> >ORBS are Net Nazis
>
> Let me guess, you people are listed on ORBS? Just close your
> relay, and you
> will get off.
>
> FYI, as far as I know, ORBS was NOT designed as a system to
> DELETE or BLOCK
> E-mail from open relays. It was designed to LET PEOPLE KNOW that open
> relays exist. They are simply trying to stop open relays.
>
> What is the problem with, for example, adding a header to an
> E-mail that
> says "[This E-mail came from an open relay in ORBS]"? That
> way, the user
> can decide what they want to do with the E-mail. And, the
> amount of spam
> YOU receive will go down, because more people will close their relays,
> giving spammers fewer places to spew.
>
> The main reason people complain about ORBS so much is because they are
> listed in it. If you are listed in it, you are inviting
> spammers to abuse
> your mail server, and you need to fix it.
>
> Remember, ORBS also has a number of different databases. I
> have *NEVER*
> heard anyone complain about their "Spam Source" database, for
> example, that
> ONLY lists known spam sources.
>
> ORBS isn't bad; the people who abuse it (by deleting E-mail
> coming from IPs
> listed in ORBS) are. Just use ORBS in a way that lets the
> END USER decide
> how to handle the E-mail.
>
>
> --
> -Scott
>
> Declude: Anti-virus and Anti-spam solutions for IMail.
> http://www.declude.com
> --
>
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