On 12/14/2010 04:41 PM, Russel Winder wrote:

Programmers would be better trained if the first language they're taught
is a traditional that compiles into native code, such as C. You know
You are joking, aren't you?  Students should know C or C++ before they
graduate, but it is not a good first language in general.   It is
important to focus first on algorithm and realization of algorithm using
a programming language.

I find that that approach is a disaster for a computing *engineering* course (I'm not talking about computer *science*). Is too theoretical and it was unfortunately the approach that universities in my country followed when I graduated. The problem was that the engineering graduation was politically dominated in the first two years by mathematicians which delivered a inflated bunch of stuff about mathematical analysis and algorithms, and the consequence was that at the third year most students didn't have any practical knowledge of what a computer was (unless they had already one, like me, or they came from a technically oriented school). They had exams about digital signal manipulation, but nobody explained C to them. A total mess.

It's true that today almost everybody knows what a computer is before entering the university, but I still think that practice-oriented approaches are better for engineers.

Also consider that many students either can't make through the end of the university (this figure changes a lot from country to country) or can pause their studies for earning money and then resume. Thus if they first learn C, Java or C# they have more chances to take advantage of it, rather than other languages. That's why I think that university must teach even languages which are radically different than C or Java, but *after* C, Java or C#.

Indeed it's a complex topic, because it also depends on what you possibly learn about computers in the secondary schools, which again I suspect is something very different from country to country.


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Fabrizio Giudici - Java Architect, Project Manager
Tidalwave s.a.s. - "We make Java work. Everywhere."
java.net/blog/fabriziogiudici - www.tidalwave.it/people
fabrizio.giud...@tidalwave.it

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