how about cause it rocks, cause I am tired of talking in the desert, cause
it's the future, cause you need to grow OUT OF THE F*CKING DATABASE, cause
the component world of SAP is real, cause it's a natural OS, cause you are
going to be left behind and cause we all love peace, love and good Code (I
love to love!)
marc
|-----Original Message-----
|From: Kenworthy, Edward [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
|Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2000 12:53 AM
|To: 'jBoss'
|Subject: RE: [jBoss-User] J2EE Too Much for Small App? Rocky Honeymoon!
|
|
|Personally I think you should go for it.
|
|My reasons are:
|
|
|1) Security. Not the "You can log into the system therefore can do anything
|any other user of your role can do" but the "You are Edward Kenworthy
|therefore when I look up Pension Details I'll only show you yours" or "You
|are Edward Kenworthy, who is a User, but I see you have expertise
|in Selling
|Mortgages so I'll let you do this stuff extra" ie more fine grained access
|control based on potentially complex and dynamic combinations of access
|rights.
|
|2) Scalability. 'nuff said.
|
|3) Portability. (Probably not important to you but it is to us ;) with care
|you can write for one EJB AppServer and have your applicaiton run
|on any EJB
|AppServer (and therefore pretty much any extant operating system).
|
|4) Failover. Tricky one this. The spec' says that AppServers should handle
|failover of entities (ie nothing gets lost, but you could lose your
|connection) but doesn't specify that stateful session beans are maintained
|(statless of course doesn't matter). I suspect, for a straightforward,
|non-ecommerce, web-site this isn't a problem.
|
|Database independence is a red herring really. JDBC gives you that (as long
|as your are careful not to use ANY non-standard features of your database.
|Like joins ;) What the container transparently adds is support for
|concurrent access etc etc.
|
|Oh and forget CMP. It is just awful (I'm talking about the spec in general
|here not jBoss's implementation of it). Frankly CMP is a waste of
|time. It's
|only useful if you're writing a teeny-tiny system - and if that's the case
|why are you using an AppServer ? ;-)
|
|-----Original Message-----
|From: Hunter Hillegas [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
|Sent: 06 December 2000 20:11
|To: jBoss
|Subject: Re: [jBoss-User] J2EE Too Much for Small App? Rocky Honeymoon!
|
|
|Thanks for the defense Edward!
|
|Thanks to the list for all the responses.
|
|Maybe I should clarify a few points.
|
|1. My company does it's own hosting so that's not a problem. I can use
|whatever I want (they might balk at a WebLogic license however ;-)).
|
|2. I am re-writing the site no matter what. I need to add many new features
|and PHP doesn't cut it for OO design or logic/presentation abstraction. I
|also need to be able to change databases easier since I may need to move to
|Oracle in the future. The site will basically be TOTALLY new when it's
|completed.
|
|3. The site does make money and is growing very quickly but it's a
|hobby. If
|the whole thing crashed down in flames the only one seriously
|impacted would
|be me.
|
|The whole reason I wrote the list was to get a feel for whether or not I
|should go with EJB in ADDITION to the JSP/Servlet approach I am planning.
|
|I am NOT some buzzword crazy manager that doesn't know better. I will be
|doing the coding. I want to create a base that I can expand on in
|the future
|to offer some cool Web services to the public.
|
|At this point I haven't decided what route to take. I know I don't NEED EJB
|at this point but it might be helpful in the future when I need to deploy
|the backend across several machines portably, etc...
|
|Again, thanks for your input. I appreciate it.
|
|--
|Hunter Hillegas
|[EMAIL PROTECTED]
|
|> From: "Kenworthy, Edward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
|> Reply-To: "jBoss" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
|> Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 13:36:51 -0000
|> To: "'jBoss'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
|> Subject: RE: [jBoss-User] J2EE Too Much for Small App? Rocky Honeymoon!
|>
|> Gosh! Lay off the guy. You have no idea why he's decided to re-write his
|> site, so why is everyone coming down on him like he's some kind
|of a moron
|?
|>
|> -----Original Message-----
|> From: fred [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
|> Sent: 06 December 2000 22:20
|> To: jBoss
|> Subject: Re: [jBoss-User] J2EE Too Much for Small App? Rocky Honeymoon!
|>
|>
|> Hi Hunter,
|>
|> I think you need to read this article, by Brett Mclaughlin, "Enterprise
|> Applications in Java and J2EE: A Rocky Honeymoon."
|>
|> visit: http://java.oreilly.com/news/j2ee_0700.html
|>
|> An excerpt:
|>
|> All too often, people
|> go overboard with their applications. In geek talk, this is
|> called "buzzmania." Buzzmania is the tendency to buy
|> more, get more, and use more, simply because more
|> "buzzwords" are in a product. This is a large part of the
|> J2EE problem. With the J2EE product descriptions and
|> specifications reading like a meeting of exotic 12-step
|> programs--JSP, XML, JMS, EJB, CMP, BMP, OR, JDBC--it's
|> no wonder managers' eyes light up at sales presentations.
|>
|> However, the reality is few companies, and few
|> industries, need all these services. I'd estimate 50% to
|> 70% of the companies that have purchased or are
|> purchasing J2EE solutions could easily get by with a
|> simple servlet and a JDBC-based solution. Presentation
|> logic housed in the servlet coupled with database access
|> through JDBC would suffice for most types of
|> applications, including many e-commerce solutions.
|> Adding JSP, or another presentation technology, such as
|> Enhydra XMLC, makes this an even more robust option.
|>
|>
|> Regards
|> Fred
|>
|>
|>
|> Hunter Hillegas wrote:
|>
|>> I am new to J2EE.
|>>
|>> I have been using Servlets and JSP for some time but have never touched
|> EJB.
|>> I recently took a class from Sun on J2EE and I want to get started with
|> some
|>> of it.
|>>
|>> I have a Web site that's currently powered by PHP and mySQL called
|>> RateVegas.com.
|>>
|>> I've been planning a total site makeover for several months
|with many new
|>> features. I've decided to move to PostgreSQL and Java.
|>>
|>> The question is whether to use JSP/Servlets/Taglibs or to include EJB in
|>> that equation.
|>>
|>> What I'm really asking is if J2EE is "too much" for a relatively simple
|>> application?
|>>
|>> RateVegas.com basically lets users rate hotels and restaurants in Las
|> Vegas.
|>> There is a fair amount of DB activity but they are simple queries.
|>>
|>> The new version of the site will be totally personalizable and will be
|>> somewhat more complex.
|>>
|>> Do you think using J2EE is overkill?
|>>
|>> Hunter
|>>
|>> --
|>> --------------------------------------------------------------
|>> To subscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
|>> To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
|>> Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
|>
|>
|>
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