https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=508196
--- Comment #96 from pallaswept <[email protected]> --- (In reply to NecRaul from comment #93) > (In reply to pallaswept from comment #87) > > (In reply to NecRaul from comment #85) > > > (In reply to pallaswept from comment #83) > > > > (In reply to emanon from comment #82) > > > > > Dolphin should behave like all the other file managers. > > > > > > > > Obvious troll is obvious. > > > > > > You can't just dismiss everyone who disagrees with you as a troll. > > Never have. > Starting off with a lie. Easy to say its a lie but you can't prove it because you're lying when you say it. You're trolling. Scroll ito your own reply and you can find yourself saying you've never supported this concept and yet here you are opening with it.... I'll remind you when we get down there... > You are not the authority on what constitutes trolling. Nor do I need to be, I just need to be able to tell when I'm reading one, like now. > The same arguments > have been made repeatedly by different people, not because they are trolls, > but because the concerns are reasonable. No, they're not reasonable, and I demonstrated why, severalfold, and even if they had been, just repeating them over and over adds nothing to the conversation other than to bait me, which is exactly what you're doing. > Dismissing them as trolling simply > avoids engaging with the substance of what is being said. Except I've already engaged with substance, repeatedly, for months, and they've given NOTHING BUT TROLLING. And now you're joining in. > Throughout this thread, you have focused largely on semantic distinctions, > such as CWD versus PWD. That's a lie. I didn't focus on it, on the contrary. Let's read that again shall we: > PWD stands for "Print Working Directory", it is a command, not a location > (actually it's not even a command, the command is "pwd"). You mean "CWD" > which stands for "Current Working Directory". Using these terms > interchangeably was done in the discuss thread for the purpose of continuity > but should not leak out of it as it is incorrect. That's it, that's all I said about that. No focus, just a quick explanation for those who were mis-using the term, and left it at that. > While those terms are technically different, that > distinction is not central to the issue being discussed. In practical > conversation, both can be used interchangeably when the meaning is clear > from context. And yet it's clear that you didn't understand what they mean if you're arguing that the view directory is the same as the CWD/'pwd'/whaateveryoucallit, because it isn't, the selection is. > The people you keep labeling as trolls have raised legitimate concerns No they have not. They've repeated that "dolphin should act like all the other file managers" over and over. That's trolling. A legitimate concern would be "wow, I never realised that the selection actually matters here, and it's throwing me for a loop, can we somehow make the UX more intuitive here while not also screwing all the power users?" And I directly addressed exactly that. > Instead, you have dominated the thread No, I've had my inbox dominated by the trolls in this thread who won't just let it sit. I'm just replying to you guys. I'm not dominating anything, I'm just replying. I tried to not reply, and not feed the trolls, and TraceyC did that for me instead. > while positioning yourself as the gatekeeper of what counts as valid feedback. I'm not positioning myself as anything, except for maybe history teacher and target for trolls. I didn't invent selection or the mouse. None of this is new. It's not coming from me. > > Is all I've discussed. > You claim to have only engaged in relevant discussion, yet you also admit to > antagonizing so called trolls. No, not so-called trolls. Trolls. Of course I didn't engage in relevant discussion with trolls, none of you are discussing anything relevant. You're just trolling. What part of this post of yours that I'm replying to, is contributing to a solution? None of it, it's just troll from beginning to end. > That behavior does not contribute > constructively to resolving the issue. It does, it means at least one person is the voice of sanity here and not just an obvious troll trying to ruin dolphin because trolling pallaswept is fun and dolphin seems to matter to him. > > A uniform solution that's intuitive for everyone and not gimped for everyone > > to appease users who lack understanding seems like a smart way to do it. > If uniformity is the goal, then a consistent approach would be to extend the > behavior currently present in Details View to the other views as well. Mightn't hurt. One user on the forums even explained how this could be done without it being unintuitive for you guys. > That > idea, much like universal uniformity is stupid. Mouse driven workflows and > keyboard driven workflows are fundamentally different, and treating them as > identical ignores how people actually use their systems. What about keyboard and mouse driven workflows? Or keyboard OR mouse driven workflows. What about the workflows that use both interchangeably? What about footswitches and mouth straws and eye trackers? There's a whole world of input you've never even thought about. Universal uniformity has functionality you obviously haven't considered. > For example, (AFAIK default behavior) double clicking the background selects > all items. That does not mean pressing Enter twice should trigger the same > behavior. It *does* mean that clicking *or* pressing space should select, and of course, the action a user performs should occur to the selection, because that's literally what it's for. > If multiple folders are selected, should Ctrl+Shift+N create a new > folder inside each of them? Now you're actually asking useful questions. More of this and less of "SamE aS thE oTHeR fiLe ManAgERs" would make this whole bug report a whole lot better. You wanna not get called a troll? Ask actually useful questions like that. Wanna repeat the same exact argument we've all heard literally dozens of times? I'm gonna call you a troll for acting like a troll. Your call. BTW the answer is to use the active selection (the one with the square around it) > The previous behavior was intuitive for users. And it was also unintuitive for users, and that’s the awkward part nobody wants to seem to deal with. It's gotta be "my way or the highway" and its counterproductive. It was intuitive for users who don't understand how selection works. And that’s a lot of users and that’s a real problem. But that doesn't mean it's the right way to do it, at the expense of all the users who do understand how selection is meant to work and find it ....not working. > If you have the ability to > read, Real mature son. > maybe read that "Development Philosophy" that was posted earlier in > the thread Already did of course. > and try to understand if it's valuable or if it should be removed > or changed because you want it to be. No need to change it. This is basic Simon stuff. Simon understands that selection works how it does. He's been a developer for 8 years, he knows that when you click something to select it and then perform an action then the selection is the target of the action. It's pretty basic knowledge. Even Lisa knows this from using MS Word. But nice straw man trying to suggest I'm trying to change the design goals of dolphin just because I am not Fred. Those design goals say it shouldn't be made for Fred, and Fred is the "I don't know how selection works" guy in that crowd. And heck, I'm even trying to accommodate the various trolls pretending to be Fred here, but maybe you're right, maybe all these guys who don't understand selection should just cry more? idk about that but hey this is your argument. > Oh the savior of KDE bug tracker whose many comments were tagged as spam. I > guess one of the KDE people must be a troll who has it out for you. At least one is, yep. Probably more. But thanks for pouring on the sarcasm like a corrupt moderator reinforces your point any at all. > You have repeatedly misrepresented my position. Repeatedly or just the once? Oh yeh it's just the once. But yeh, I did. I hate to break it to you but I'm not exactly taking note of which troll is which. Why would I? And besides, it's kinda ironic for you to complain about my misrepresenting your position while you've just done the same to me several times in a single post. > Please refrain from attributing positions to me that I have not expressed. I will do my best but if you're gonna stand in a crowd of trolls shouting along with them just because you don't like what I'm saying, you're just another one of the trolls. Perhaps if I weren't dealing with so many at once it'd be easier to track who's who. > > I sure as heck don't see any evidence of you having spun up 6 different > > distros looking for inspiration for a solution and references to how other > > similar apps deal with this. > By your own argument, comparing Dolphin to other file managers is > irrelevant. So suggesting that I should test multiple distributions for > inspiration contradicts your earlier point. No it doesn't what are you talking abut. I tested those file managers specifically to prove my earlier point that "like all the other file managers" isn't a real thing, and I clearly succeeded. And taking inspiration from how other distros/OS deal with it doesn't amount to just taking the least-comparable alternative (Explorer) and copying its behaviour verbatim, which is what's been suggested here, over, and over, and over again. > I have already explained my position earlier in the thread, when the > behavior first changed. Repeating it here would serve no purpose. Other than trolling me, and here you are. > I have also proposed a solution before you joined this discussion. If you > missed > it, that is not my responsibility. That was not before I joined this discussion. I've been here since the getgo. I just tried to keep this nonsense out of the bugzilla and keep it to the forums, but the trolls are here, and I am replying. I responded to your suggestions and shared one of them, prior to your making them here, if you missed it, that's not my responsibility. > Throughout this entire discussion, your posts have been filled with > misspellings (blame your gimped hands!) The fact that I'm disabled might cause typos, yes. You calling my hands gimped is enough to get you to find out how fast they are if you come to Melbourne, son. , repeated misunderstandings, Not a one > rambling tangents, Where? > and arguments that either miss the point entirely Where? > or > deliberately misrepresent what others have said. Never happened, you're a liar and a coward. > I'll go with the metric > that you've set for others and say you are either an obvious troll or along > with your physical disability, you also have a mental one. Yeh definitely not trolling at all this guy. scum. come at me. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are watching all bug changes.
