Another interesting project is Brython, Python in the browser https://brython.info/ good documentation and demo
very heavy development, easy to install and run locally - git clone https://github.com/brython-dev/brython.git - cd brython/www - python3 -m http.server - browse to localhost:8000 (current trunk returns 404 for 'Tutorial' ) On Mon, Nov 9, 2020 at 12:27 PM Offray Vladimir Luna Cárdenas < off...@riseup.net> wrote: > Hi, > > In a world where JavaScript is a commonplace, disliking it becomes > automatically opinionated :-). > > I put sparkles of JS here and there for my web sites, but I don't plan to > make it my main programming language and now that JS transpilers are > becoming a more common place I plan to keep using Pharo as much as > possible, as for now, nothing beats its live coding experience and > programming environment. So I would say the "J" of Jamstack is more about > "JavaScript as a bridge" that as the primary language, as the "P" in LAMP > Stack meant PHP, but in some context became Python or Perl or even non P > named languages and the "M" was not about "MySQL always". > > I also like Elixir and I think that the BEAM is a pretty awesome > technology for parallelism, as it is shown in this excellent talk[1]. It is > not the place where I'm focused as I'm more interested in live coding and > moldable tools[2a] and for that Pharo[2] is a pretty powerful tool that > change the way you think about/with software. > > [1] GOTO 2019 • The Soul of Erlang and Elixir • Saša Jurić > https://youtu.be/JvBT4XBdoUE > [2] https://pharo.org/ > [2a] Tudor Gîrba - Moldable development > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pot9GnHFOVU > So, going back to the exploration of web technologies, my approach has > been to leverage the knowledge and aesthetics I already have to find a > static site generator[3] (for example a Python based one) and to create a > site on it (preferably using some pre-existing template with a good design) > and also to see the infrastructure from the point of view of an "end user" > or a community that is going to add content to such site. That is how I > went from web2py[3a] to Grav[3b] to Brea[3c], my own Pharo based CMS (as > Pharo was the language I was using to customize Grav's markdown and YAML > source files anyway). This is a story of progressive decoupling: as the > excellent and integrated web2py became kind of over complex for the stuff > we were doing/needing, Grav allow an editing experience I thought could be > friendly while we enjoyed flat file storage, which enabled redundant > storage and editing via Fossil (but it could be Git). And because we where > working with plain files, their processing could be done in several > languages (I chose Pharo). Once Grav customization became also over complex > and after seeing that nobody was using Grav's web ui the next step was to > build an even simpler solution combining Pharo, Pandoc and Fossil which > resonated strongly with the explorations of the Jamstack and the > IndieWeb[4][4a] about building your own tools and web presence. > > [3] https://jamstack.org/generators/ > [3a] http://web2py.com/ > [3b] https://getgrav.org/ > [3c] https://mutabit.com/repos.fossil/brea/ > [4] https://indieweb.org/ > [4a] https://mutabit.com/repos.fossil/indieweb/ > > Fiuuuhhh, Edward's sabbatical makes me talk even more that on-topic > conversations... ;-P ... Maybe I should write a blog post instead and > invite you to my IndieWeb place to keep the conversation. > > Cheers, > > Offray > > On 9/11/20 12:06 p. m., rengel wrote: > > JavaScript might be commonplace, but the exciting action is in functional > solutions: > i.e. Elixir (https://elixir-lang.org/) and Phoenix ( > https://phoenixframework.org/). > Why? Because JavaScript does not teach new ways of thinking. > Yes, I know, this is very opinionated... > Reinhard > > On Sunday, November 8, 2020 at 7:10:35 PM UTC+1 off...@riseup.net wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> Adding to the Arjan's excellent suggestion, I would recommend: >> >> - Computer, Build me an app: https://youtu.be/qqt6YxAZoOc >> - The Return of 'Write Less, Do More' by Rich Harris | JSCAMP 2019: >> https://youtu.be/BzX4aTRPzno >> >> For getting the overview you talk about, I would reemphasize the review >> of the Jamstack[1] and see and share (maybe with yourself using Telegram or >> some instant messaging app) several introductory videos related with >> Jamstack, as is my most effective way to train the YouTube algorithm to >> recommend me more stuff about that (I usually choose long talks about the >> subject I'm interested before going bed, so the algorithm refines its model >> to recommend me more long form content about it when I wake up next >> morning). >> >> [1] https://jamstack.org/ >> >> I have been a "coding researcher" since 2014 when I rediscovered Pharo >> and used it for my PhD, but I have also gladly ignored the web development >> since mid 90's, focusing my code/tech concerns elsewhere and I'm happy >> about that as it allow me to keep an eye on the web as a tech user, without >> paying its technical debt of gratuitous over complication. For me the web >> is more an "exportation format", so I write in agile languages/environments >> like Pandoc's Markdown, or Pharo and export for the web (or for printing). >> I write something like [2] and get something like [3] and now that the >> Jamstack is here, I see some alignment between what we are doing at the >> local community[4] and a more global movement, avoiding mid 90's monoliths >> like WordPress, Drupal, Joomla and having a more decoupled and personalized >> approach to web presence. Stuff like TinaCMS[5] (despite of being for React >> based CMS) are showing that non-technical users can also enjoy the >> benefits of decoupled CMS that developers are advocating for. >> >> [2] >> https://mutabit.com/repos.fossil/indieweb/file?name=docs/es/que-por-que.md&txt=1 >> [3] >> https://mutabit.com/repos.fossil/indieweb/doc/trunk/docs/es/que-por-que.html >> [4] https://mutabit.com/repos.fossil/indieweb/ >> [5] https://tinacms.org/ >> >> Also the approach of languages like ClojureScript and Elm to writing for >> the web without writing JavaScript but having the possibility to talk with >> its wider ecosystem have been refreshing, instead of the web as a >> monolingual culture (well trilingual: JS, HTML, CSS) of bureaucratic slow >> evolving standards that has been for nearly 20 years (I don't mind that >> much on content/HTML or presentation/CSS languages but is really painful in >> the programming/JS one). >> >> So I would say that this is a good time for someone who have avoided the >> web development to jump on it from a more diverse, decoupled, simplified >> multilingual approach, now that web is maturing and catching with features >> some of us thought it should have since its beginnings. The key would be to >> have such broad panoramic view of what is possible to avoid "upgrading to >> the 90's", as I have seen many local government institutions do when they >> start to teach web development and infrastructure. >> >> Cheers, >> >> Offray >> On 7/11/20 9:04 p. m., Arjan wrote: >> >> I'd like to suggest looking into Svelte, a modern JavaScript framework >> that's compiled at build time, so it has great performance. >> >> I enjoyed this presentation: Rich Harris - Rethinking reactivity >> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdNJ3fydeao> (Youtube) >> >> And the learning materials and REPL on https://svelte.dev/ are excellent. >> On Saturday, November 7, 2020 at 1:18:49 PM UTC+1 Edward K. Ream wrote: >> >>> It's becoming clearer what I'll be studying and exploring during the >>> sabbatical. >>> >>> For the last 25+ years I've pretty much ignored web development. That >>> surely was a mistake. There is a ton of interesting technology out there. >>> >>> My initial focus will be on node.js packages, and the frameworks and >>> technologies connect to them. I first went down this rabbit hole by looking >>> at the yarn.lock file for the jupyterlab project. This file contains all >>> the node.js package dependencies. I then googled some dependencies and took >>> a look at the packages. >>> >>> The package-lock.json file shows package dependencies for the leovue and >>> leointeg projects. >>> >>> I then thought to google something like "most popular node.js packages", >>> which unlocked 25+ years of programming effort. "Attached" to popular >>> node.js packages are major projects/frameworks such as jupyterlab, react, >>> angular, ruby on rails, vue.js, etc. etc. >>> >>> Many of these technologies can be used to build web sites. I'll build a >>> vanilla site for Rebecca using WordPress and woocommerce. Ditto for my son >>> James. After that, I may play around with various frameworks and website >>> builders. >>> >>> My plan will be to get an overview of the web world first, and then see >>> where this overview takes me. >>> >>> All comments and suggestions welcome. >>> >>> Edward >>> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "leo-editor" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to leo-editor+...@googlegroups.com. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/dd3626f5-de2c-4a8e-92a4-3b739b9701d5n%40googlegroups.com >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/dd3626f5-de2c-4a8e-92a4-3b739b9701d5n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> >> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "leo-editor" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/3a737ba4-f0da-4cde-97ca-ace5354e1a37n%40googlegroups.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/3a737ba4-f0da-4cde-97ca-ace5354e1a37n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "leo-editor" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/d7693702-cbd8-ddd4-7475-0fc143e0ccde%40riseup.net > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/d7693702-cbd8-ddd4-7475-0fc143e0ccde%40riseup.net?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "leo-editor" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/CAAa_k2fM3dcjsTVWm3J4L5FGnFpkb-_aALZ6Pa8PrDJ9FQSvWA%40mail.gmail.com.
