Linux-Advocacy Digest #34, Volume #29 Sun, 10 Sep 00 03:13:16 EDT
Contents:
Re: How low can they go...? (Donovan Rebbechi)
Re: Inferior Engineering of the Win32 Platform - was Re: Linsux as a desktop
platform (Donovan Rebbechi)
Re: How low can they go...? (Donovan Rebbechi)
Re: How low can they go...? (Donovan Rebbechi)
Re: How low can they go...? (Donovan Rebbechi)
Re: Why I hate Windows... (Tim Hanson)
Re: Why I hate Windows... (Tim Hanson)
Re: Why I hate Windows... (Tim Hanson)
[Q] linux on mac? ("Anon Y. Mous")
Re: Why I hate Windows... (Tim Hanson)
Re: Why I hate Windows... (Tim Hanson)
Re: How low can they go...? (T. Max Devlin)
Re: How low can they go...? (T. Max Devlin)
Re: How low can they go...? (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Why I hate Windows... ("Ingemar Lundin")
Re: Tholen digest, volume 2451795.83v9t^-.000000000001 (Jeff Glatt)
Re: Computer and memory ("Ingemar Lundin")
Re: How low can they go...?
Re: How low can they go...?
Windows+Linux=True ("Ingemar Lundin")
Re: The internet was built on WIndow 95? (was Re: How low can they go...?) ("Erik
Funkenbusch")
Re: The internet was built on WIndow 95? (was Re: How low can they go...?)
("Ingemar Lundin")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Donovan Rebbechi)
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: How low can they go...?
Date: 10 Sep 2000 04:43:12 GMT
On Sat, 9 Sep 2000 21:52:10 -0500, Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>Actually, if you legally purchase a piece of software, you legally own it
>regardless of the EULA (Own here means to own a copy of the liscense and
>media upon which the software has been placed). Whether or not you have the
>right to USE that software is an entirely different matter and is what the
>EULA is all about.
Does this mean that you may transfer ownsership ( that is sell ) the software
if you don't agree to the EULA ? ( for example, Win98 licenses are definitely
non transferable if you accept the EULA. )
--
Donovan
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Donovan Rebbechi)
Crossposted-To: comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.unix.advocacy
Subject: Re: Inferior Engineering of the Win32 Platform - was Re: Linsux as a desktop
platform
Date: 10 Sep 2000 04:44:36 GMT
On Sun, 10 Sep 2000 12:52:01 +1000, Christopher Smith wrote:
>Yes, I know - I use hi res terminal fonts as well. X is still better (and
>given the crappiness of X fonts that's saying something).
Huh ? If you don't like the X fonts, install some different ones. FYI,
X supports Type1, True Type and bitmap fonts.
--
Donovan
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Donovan Rebbechi)
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: How low can they go...?
Date: 10 Sep 2000 04:52:11 GMT
On Sat, 9 Sep 2000 21:38:27 -0500, Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>All said without a single iota of information to support your position.
>
>Most of the industry disagrees with you.
Max just enjoys lecturing people who know more than him. He seems to
suffer from the delusion that he knows better than everyone else,
though it's obvious to anyone who bothers to read his drivel that he's an
ignoramus on matters of software design.
--
Donovan
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Donovan Rebbechi)
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: How low can they go...?
Date: 10 Sep 2000 04:55:01 GMT
On Sun, 10 Sep 2000 12:30:59 +1000, Christopher Smith wrote:
>
>1. What is bad about HTML as a help file format.
Not terribly printable.
>2. What better idea do you have ?
For documentation, something SGML based is probably preferable, IMO.
SGML documentation can be used to spit out docs in a number of formats.
( btw, the fact that Max happened to be sort of right for a change doesn't
mean that he's not an ignoramus ... )
--
Donovan
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Donovan Rebbechi)
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: How low can they go...?
Date: 10 Sep 2000 04:55:45 GMT
On Sun, 10 Sep 2000 12:28:16 +1000, Christopher Smith wrote:
>
>Why ?
Because Max said so. Where you expecting a better reason ?
--
Donovan
------------------------------
From: Tim Hanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why I hate Windows...
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 04:56:09 GMT
I hafta tell ya...
I've had my Windows 98SE up and running without a reboot for almost a
year now with no problems. I just wish I could see something besides
that blue screen.
Anthony Wilson wrote:
>
> After using Linux for many months now, I have recently had to use W*ndoze
> for a couple of days. These are just a few things that made me realize why I
> started to use Linux in the first place
>
> 1. I have had to reboot many more times in one day of W*ndoze use (4) than
> many months of Linux use (0)
> 2. Linux does not crash when you attempt to browse your OWN hard drive - let
> alone a network one
> 3.Linux does not kill itself when you try to run an old console app, unlike
> w*ndoze with DOS
> 4. Linux dialup connections do not mysteriously stop working whilst in use.
> 5. Linux does not suffer massive disk fragmentation in basic non demanding
> use
>
> need I say any more...
>
> Anthony Wilson (happy Linux user)
--
A child of five could understand this! Fetch me a child of five.
------------------------------
From: Tim Hanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why I hate Windows...
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 04:59:43 GMT
Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>
> "Mig" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:8oug5k$ne7$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > Oh comeon Ingemar. Not even NT that i use stays up two days without a
> > reboot.... it just gets slower and slower and slower and finally i have to
> > reboot to make it faster.
>
> I posted some screenshots of my task manager a few days ago. It showed that
> the distributed.net client on my machine has been running for 707 hours (or
> about 30 days). It's now 798 hours. And this is an NT4 machine, the
> supposedly unstable version (I do have SP6 applied). I use this machine
> daily for software development, internet useage (I have IE 5.5 installed),
> and several other tasks. This machine get's heavy useage. It's running a
> Diamond Stealth 3D video card (2MB, rather old) at 1152x864 in 16 bit color,
> a PII-350 on an ABit BX6 motherboard (over 2 years old) with 196MB of RAM
> (of which only about 70MB is used in typical scenarios.
>
> This machine is rock solid solid stable and has never BSOD'd and never
> suffers from these mysterious slowdowns people talk about.
>
> > With Win98 forget. If what you say is correct then you have a fresh
> install
> > and only use 2 or 3 programs. This is actually the secret to run Win98
> > stable dont install and deinstall too many programs or otherwise the
> > registry acts funny.
>
> My 98SE install is about a year old. My girlfriend uses it daily for
> Office/net surfing/game playing. I also have distributed.net running on it
> 24 hours so it's never shut down. dnet has been going for over 3 weeks
> straight now.
Three weeks. Ooooo...
>
> > Win 98 is not as unstable has claimed but it is very close and certainly
> no
> > OS for "real work" - whatever that is :-)
>
> It's certainly not rock solid, but only the most broken apps can bring it
> down (that includes faulty drivers).
Golly, 800 hours is really crummy. You're proud of that?? That's 33
days, more or less. I suppose when the standard is low it's easy to
exceed it.
--
A child of five could understand this! Fetch me a child of five.
------------------------------
From: Tim Hanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why I hate Windows...
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 05:01:18 GMT
Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>
> "Slip Gun" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > WOW! You must have one hell of a PC! (Maybe a bit like the Love Bug). I
> > haven't been able to run 'doze for more than about 8 hours without
> > massive slowdown and crashing. Please tell me how you manage to achive
> > this.
>
> It's not that difficult. Just maintain your system. Always keep your BIOS
> and drivers up to date, make sure you prune your registry tree to remove
> cruft, delete your cache files every so often, clean out your temp directory
> every so often, and don't install hundreds of crappy utilities written by
> some kid in his basement.
Or, get Linux and forget about all that foolishness.
--
A child of five could understand this! Fetch me a child of five.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 01:05:02 -0400
From: "Anon Y. Mous" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [Q] linux on mac?
if i install linux on a mac, how difficult is the conversion?
--
*please post to NG only*
------------------------------
From: Tim Hanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why I hate Windows...
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 05:19:06 GMT
"Aaron R. Kulkis" wrote:
>
> Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
> >
> > "Slip Gun" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message > > And you
> > don't consider vi to be a basic and non-descript tool?
> > >
> > > At least vi leaves me free to do *exactly* what I want. And I can always
> > > use something more fancy if I want to - there are plenty of
> > > configuration tools out there. Windoze ran my computer as Bill wanted
> > > it, not as I wanted it.
> >
> > Just because you don't know how to configure you Windows system doesn't mean
> > that nobody else does either. I'd venture that 99% of the people that use
> > Windows couldn't figure out how to configure a Linux system either.
>
> The problem is, 99% of the people that use Windows can't figure out
> how to configure a Windows system, either.
>
> (Hint: keeping user-data on C: is idiotic)
>
> --
> Aaron R. Kulkis
The only way I feel safe keeping user data (Quicken files, etc.) on a
Windows system is to put them on Linux and access them as Samba shares.
------------------------------
From: Tim Hanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why I hate Windows...
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 05:32:55 GMT
Slip Gun wrote:
>
> Wise words :-)
> What will it take to break those bastards?
> Cheers,
> Ed
Hard telling. They're in the crosshairs of so many institutions right
now. Everyone from IBM to the Boobsy Twins (Ellison & McNealy) to the
Peoples' Republic of China. They've blown they're best partnerships and
alienated their developers. I hope it's this time.
Eric Raymond believes Q1, 2001.
>
> Thomas Corriher wrote:
>
> > I completely agree. Their next "desktop" was Win 95. This
> > was when Microsoft changed its' design priorities from producing
> > better software to crippling other's software. "DOS isn't done
> > till Lotus won't run." We have many other examples like their
> > having given Netscape the wrong TCP/IP stack specs for the
> > Win 95 release. None of us can forget the dirty tricks played
> > on Dr DOS or OS/2 either. The list appears endless. With a
> > monopoly position, a company does not need to concern itself
> > with such trivial issues as stability, reliability, standards,
> > security, professional ethics, or even price. Customers will
> > return for more because they do not have a choice. Customers
> > can only hope that they are at least given a kiss before the
> > company 'gives it to them'.
> >
<snip>
--
A child of five could understand this! Fetch me a child of five.
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: How low can they go...?
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 01:46:19 -0400
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
[...]
>No, not under that name. They buy back "preowned" games and sell them out
>again as preowned games. For example they buy back a game that sold for
>whatever the new price was. They pay a very reduced price for it, and sell
>it to the public for somewhere between the new price and the price they paid
>for it.
>
>My early message was reguarding computer stores selling preowned software.
>A person that stated that software can not be transfered by software
>consumers and that software so transfered would be pirated. So, I asked
>that person; if that is so, how can chain software stores purchase and
>resell used software, often called "preowned".
You mentioned renting, that's all I asked about.
--
T. Max Devlin
-- Such is my recollection of my reconstruction
of events at the time, as I recall. Consider it.
Research assistance gladly accepted. --
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
======= Over 80,000 Newsgroups = 16 Different Servers! ======
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: How low can they go...?
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 01:49:50 -0400
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Simon Cooke in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
[...]
>> I've never argued about software development practices. Get a grip.
>
>Yes you have:
>
>I quote:
>">> COM sucks, 'componentized' applications suck, but I think you'll find
>>> that if you pay attention to what I'm saying, you'll see that there's a
>>> lot that sucks. None of it sucks worse than Microsoft software, but
>>> just about all of it sucks a little.
>>>
>>> Componentized is a great idea. For developers. For operational
>>> functionality; it sucks. Shared libraries don't suck (much).
>>> Componentized applications do."
>
>I can quote more if you'd like? HTML Help being one example, the use of
>embedded browser rendering surfaces being another.
Oh, you mean software *design*. I thought you meant "software
development practices" when you said "software development practices".
As for software design, all I care about is whether I want to buy it, or
whether the many people who ask me or pay me for advice want to buy it.
In that case, I'll remind you that while 'componentized software' might
make things easy for developers, it sucks as a *software design*. When
developers get their head out of their asses, and realize that software
*users* care about different things than software *developers*, maybe
we'll get some software that isn't only 'better than nothing'.
--
T. Max Devlin
-- Such is my recollection of my reconstruction
of events at the time, as I recall. Consider it.
Research assistance gladly accepted. --
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
======= Over 80,000 Newsgroups = 16 Different Servers! ======
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: How low can they go...?
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 01:50:55 -0400
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Donovan Rebbechi in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>On Sun, 10 Sep 2000 12:30:59 +1000, Christopher Smith wrote:
>>
>
>>1. What is bad about HTML as a help file format.
>
>Not terribly printable.
>
>>2. What better idea do you have ?
>
>For documentation, something SGML based is probably preferable, IMO.
>SGML documentation can be used to spit out docs in a number of formats.
>
>( btw, the fact that Max happened to be sort of right for a change doesn't
>mean that he's not an ignoramus ... )
LOLROTFLMAO
--
T. Max Devlin
-- Such is my recollection of my reconstruction
of events at the time, as I recall. Consider it.
Research assistance gladly accepted. --
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
======= Over 80,000 Newsgroups = 16 Different Servers! ======
------------------------------
From: "Ingemar Lundin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why I hate Windows...
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 05:56:13 GMT
aaah...but you see Tim, if you say something like that, then you are a
"fucking lying bitch" according to "Aaron R Kulkis", a frequent flamer (and
bullshitter) on this NG.
/IL
"Tim Hanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> skrev i meddelandet
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> I hafta tell ya...
>
> I've had my Windows 98SE up and running without a reboot for almost a
> year now with no problems. I just wish I could see something besides
> that blue screen.
>
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jeff Glatt)
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Tholen digest, volume 2451795.83v9t^-.000000000001
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 06:03:39 GMT
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] (tholenturdletbot)
>On Thu, 07 Sep 2000 12:00:44 GMT, "Joe Malloy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> in
>comp.sys.mac.advocacy wrote:
>>[Wake me, will ya, when Tholen begins to say anything of any importance.]
>What else is the poor boy to do, semi-employed in Hawaii?
He should do drugs... preferably prescribed by his psychiatrist
------------------------------
From: "Ingemar Lundin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Computer and memory
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 06:14:13 GMT
no no c'mon now, i dont think Aaron is a Nazi...hes just a one big assshole.
cant take him seriously
/IL
"Pim van Riezen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> skrev i meddelandet
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> On Fri, 8 Sep 2000, Aaron R. Kulkis wrote:
>
> > Fuck Godwin, you idiot.
>
> Nazi!
>
> I lose. EOArgument.
> Pi
>
> --
> A mouse is a device used to focus xterms.
>
------------------------------
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: How low can they go...?
Date: Sat, 9 Sep 2000 23:09:06 -0700
Reply-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> This is the kind of stuff that makes people like Erik so horribly
> draining. The whole thing is so disfunctional after fifteen years of
> monopoly that people actually can't tell a good idea from a stupid one.
What too many people forget is:
Just because something can be done does not mean it should be done.
and
All progress is change but not all change is progress.
BTW have you noticed that nobody has responded to by question of "Did
Quicken work before they adopted the use of HTML for their user interface?"
------------------------------
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: How low can they go...?
Date: Sat, 9 Sep 2000 23:38:45 -0700
Reply-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> You mentioned renting, that's all I asked about.
As a matter of fact I didn't, I was talking about stores buying and selling
"preowned" games. It was Quantum Leaper that mentioned software rental when
he said, "I'm not saying they don't, I just wonder were they are, I still
remember when a local computer store used to rent games." Up to the second
comma he was referring to my comments reguarding the trade in preowned
software. It was up to that I was responding to. The rest of the quote ",
I still remember when a local computer store used to rent games.", was a
sepperate issue. Since it was all one sentence and it was not too long,
quoted the whole thing, not realizing at the time that it could lead to
confusion.
Below is the message by Quantum Leaper that introduced the subject of
rental:
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:8p9u92$o2m$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> Quantum Leaper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:COZt5.18110$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >
> > I haven't seen any used 'Computer game' for quite awhile, though I do
see
> > alot of used console games.
>
> In this area there are three chain computer stores (it does appear as
though
> on is currently taking over another so we may soon have only two) that
> specialize in computer games and also sell game consoles. They each have
What are the computers stores? Atleast in my area, NONE sell computer
games, I have been to just about all of them in my area. Also I have never
seen any store in the Chicago area buy/sell used computer games, though
alot of them sell console games. So it includes alot of the big computer
chain stores, like Best Buy and others.
> used computer games, sometimes boxed sometime with only CD in jewel boxes.
> They also have signs promoting the buy back of games. The new computer
game
> boxes come stickers with slogans like "played it? Trade it!" I for one
I'm not saying they don't, I just wonder were they are, I still remember
when a local computer store used to rent games.
------------------------------
From: "Ingemar Lundin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Windows+Linux=True
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 06:54:22 GMT
Know what i would like?
Linux kernel and shell plus Windows 2000:s GUI
Yeah thats right....easy enough for inexperienced users, and still the
possibly to do some good ol' fashion die-hard nerd work in the shell (or
"behind the GUI", whatever you like)
KDE and Gnome? well version 1.2 of Gnome comes a long way, but still not
easy enough for millions of Window users that Linux (hopefully) will
attract... still no gnome windowmanager and a whole lot of inconsistencies
in the GUI.(AND rather buggy still)
there you have it
/IL
------------------------------
From: "Erik Funkenbusch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: The internet was built on WIndow 95? (was Re: How low can they go...?)
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 02:15:14 -0500
"lyttlec" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > I'm sorry, but BBS's were not using Netscape in 1995, and Intranet
hadn't
> > even been coined yet. I doubt many companies were using Intranets and
> > Netscape much in 1995, certainly not 30+ million users
> IIRC, the 40,000,000 number originated with MS. The word "Intranet"
> hadn't been coined yet, but IBM and MS were competing for the business
> of connecting up business'. One bank at the time was trying to hire
> 20,000 programmers to build their system. We were all like "yeah, right"
> about their ads. Cisco was doing good already. IBM was marketing
> software to permit corporate headquarters to monitor the amount of
> memory in PCs at remote offices ( memory was expensive). I had a lot of
> work during that time wiring buildings for "internal computer networks".
What are you talking about? This discussion is *SOLELY* about how many
Windows 3.1 users were using Trumpet Winsock with Netscape Navigator.
That's it. Nothing else.
> I don't know how many users Netscape had, but Mosaic and Crimera had a
> lot. Tim O'Rielly had already launched his "Web Crawler" and "Internet
> in a box" products. AOL was doing good and Sears had launched its
> unspeakable service. So 40,000,000 connected to some kind of network and
> using winsock wasn't so unreasonable as to be dismissed out of hand. It
> was probably inflated though.
At the time of Win95's release, AOL had 3 million members and was not
providing internet service to it's users. It only had internet mail
gateways. Internet service began in early 1996.
It's fact. The number of users on the internet did not break 10 million
until 1996. There certainly were not 30+ million using Netscape on Windows
3.1 in 1995.
------------------------------
From: "Ingemar Lundin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: The internet was built on WIndow 95? (was Re: How low can they go...?)
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 07:07:38 GMT
YES!
Next Q?
/IL
> Do you honestly believe that Windows could replace all the internet
servers
> and routers and firewalls and backbones as easily?
>
>
>
>
------------------------------
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