Linux-Advocacy Digest #696, Volume #29 Mon, 16 Oct 00 22:13:08 EDT
Contents:
Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux? (lyttlec)
Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux? (lyttlec)
Re: Astroturfing (lyttlec)
Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux? (Grant Edwards)
Re: Astroturfing ("Erik Funkenbusch")
Re: Astroturfing ("Les Mikesell")
Re: Linux Sucks (Bob Hauck)
Re: Linux Sucks (Bob Hauck)
Slashdot strikes again! (Charlie Ebert)
Re: Astroturfing ("fmc")
Re: Why the Linonuts fear me (Terry Porter)
Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux? (Matt Garman)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: lyttlec <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux?
Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 01:10:42 GMT
jazz wrote:
>
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> > There is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING in the Linux world that will 100 percent
> > emulate MSOffice. Nothing at all.
> >
> > THe Linux toys are a joke. Try them for yourself and see how well your
> > presentations translate.
> >
> > When the rest of the world is running Office, why should you run some
> > half assed wannabe?
> >
> > Is your job worth it?
> >
> >
> > claire
> >
> >
> > On Sun, 15 Oct 2000 17:23:44 -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > (jazz) wrote:
> >
> > >I really need a powerful word processor with templates, styles, etc.
> > >
> > >What is available for Linux? How about for Powerpoint and Excel?
> > >
> > >Thanks ---
> > >Jazz
>
> Well, since my job is to do research on how the brain works, I don't think
> I'm going to get fired over my choice of word processors. Unless I decide
> to fire myself.
>
> Why leave Office?
>
Because the referees will make nicer comments if your paper looks
professional, i.e. you sent in a typeset copy rather than a cheesy
Word/Powerpoint amateur looking paper. If it looks like you care, then
others assume you do and cut you some slack. They will still go over the
technical content, but the comments will be more helpful and positive.
Such as "Would you consider adding a reference here?" instead of
"Insufficient references, rewrite".
> Because I want to run Unix/Linux to develop OpenGL applications to display
> functioning brains, will never touch Windows, and the expense of keeping a
> reasonably current mac around just to do my word processing seems a bit of
> a waste of your tax dollars?
>
> Thanks for the info, that's as I expected.
>
> All I ask for is the ability to import Star Office files into Word. Possible?
>
> Thanks
> Jim
------------------------------
From: lyttlec <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux?
Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 01:13:40 GMT
jazz wrote:
>
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> > On Sun, 15 Oct 2000 19:44:43 -0400, jazz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > >All I ask for is the ability to import Star Office files into Word. Possible?
> >
> > Yes, it is possible. However, be aware that there are a few conversion issues.
> > In general, documents will be imported/exported properly, but I've found that
> > sometimes tables and other odds-and-ends don't come out 100% correct.
> >
> > You should run StarOffice and create a few test documents that use the
> features
> > you will be using. Swap between SO and Word and see what happens. Make sure
> > that you create the original test documents in both SO and Word and do two
> > separate test.
> >
> > Another possibility is to use HTML for true portability, but most publishing
> > houses will not support that.
>
> Well, the problem is that everyone I work with uses word, so I have to
> give them documents in word. Even professional journals in my field prefer
> to receive articles in word attachments, though some still accept Latex.
>
> Thanks for your help.
>
> Jim
If that is the case the just do the simplest most straight forward
layout you can. Everything will be lost in the translation so any fancy
formatting is a waste of time. Keep it simple and use whatever comes to
hand. All the mentioned wordprocessors can handle that.
------------------------------
From: lyttlec <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Astroturfing
Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 01:23:44 GMT
Chad Myers wrote:
>
> "lyttlec" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > Mike Byrns wrote:
> > >
> > > lyttlec wrote:
> > >
> > > > MS had to change the name. Now its Microsoft Certified Software
> > > > Professional.
> > >
> > > No. They didn't. It's not changed at all. See
> > >
> >http://www.microsoft.com/trainingandservices/default.asp?PageID=mcp&PageCall=mc
> se&SubSite=cert>/mcse&AnnMenu=mcse
> > >
> > I'm only going by the titles of the *current* edition of books on the
> > shelves at B&N and Borders. I've noticed that MSCE has been replaced by
> > MSCP.
>
> Book titles by which publisher?
>
> Microsoft Press still refers to it as MCSE.
> http://mspress.microsoft.com/findabook/list/subject_category_T.htm
>
> If you go to:
> http://www.microsoft.com/trainingandservices/default.asp?
> PageID=mcp&PageCall=mcse&SubSite=cert/mcse&AnnMenu=mcse
>
> (URL wrapped for readability)
>
> You'll see that the certification is still titled MCSE.
>
> Given the facts, I'd say that you're lying or grossly misinformed.
>
> -Chad
In the bookstores the new books have "MCSP" Microsoft Certified
Solutions Provider or Microsoft Certified Software Professional, "MCDBA"
Microsoft Certified Data Base Administrator, "MSNA" Microsoft Certified
Network Administrator. The older books still show MSCE. But it doesn't
matter much what MS says. Just don't call yourself an Engineer on your
business card if you go into consulting.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Grant Edwards)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux?
Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 01:35:57 GMT
In article <8seufm$c7d$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, MH wrote:
>Latex is fine. But try to give this to an experienced user of Word and it's
>not going to happen in this life time.
Wow. Word must be far worse than I had initially thoought if using it
causes so much brain damage that it renders the user incapable of learning
simple tasks with even a lifetime to do so.
Learning to use LaTeX is certainly no more difficult than learning to use
Word. Provided with a set of LaTeX templates, I've seen people with no
typesetting or programming experience whatsoever producing within a day
documents that looked like they were professionally typeset. You can spend
the rest of your life plus most of the next one futzing with Word and will
never end up with anything that wouldn't make a discerning reader gag.
--
Grant Edwards grante Yow! My mind is making
at ashtrays in Dayton...
visi.com
------------------------------
From: "Erik Funkenbusch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Astroturfing
Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2000 20:53:38 -0500
"lyttlec" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> In the bookstores the new books have "MCSP" Microsoft Certified
> Solutions Provider or Microsoft Certified Software Professional, "MCDBA"
> Microsoft Certified Data Base Administrator, "MSNA" Microsoft Certified
> Network Administrator. The older books still show MSCE. But it doesn't
> matter much what MS says. Just don't call yourself an Engineer on your
> business card if you go into consulting.
MCSP is a different certification than MCSE. MCSP is a certificaiton for
management if I recall correctly, while the MSNA is limited only to
networking versus Windows support, etc...
------------------------------
From: "Les Mikesell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Astroturfing
Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 01:42:27 GMT
"JS/PL" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> >
> > You should just be able to add append "mem=256" to the relevant section
of
> > your lilo.conf and rerun lilo and it will work. That'll tell Linux
exactly
> how
> > much memory it can use, overriding what the BIOS told it.
>
> Windows 2000 doesn't have a problem figuring out how much ram is
available,
> neither does the system bios which is aware of total ram.
There is an 'old' standard way for bios to pass the memory size that is
limited to 64M (probably thought up by the same guy who brought us
the 640k limit, the 32M disk limit, then the 2.1G disk limit, then the
8.4G limit, and so on. There is also a 'new' standard way for larger
numbers that Linux understands. Obviously your bios isn't using it.
> My needs, and most others I would guess are to let the OS handle the basic
> hardware with no input form me, no editing .conf files, no anything.
Then you would be wise to buy equipment that follows the standards.
> I can
> insert the Win2k disk, and basicly let it install with minimal input.
Microsoft has no trouble prying secrets from hardware vendors.
> I did however attempt to edit the lilo.conf which is on the boot floppy,
> unfortunately for some reason I got an error message instead of a look at
> the disk when I tried to open it, why wasn't I surprised.
The lilo.conf file should be in /etc. Just edit it and run /sbin/lilo, then
reboot.
> I'll install the next Linux release I get my hands on, maybe it'll work
> right on my system.
I don't think that will make a difference. There are some gory details
here:
http://www.linuxdoc.org/HOWTO/BootPrompt-HOWTO-3.html#ss3.3
Les Mikesell
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bob Hauck)
Subject: Re: Linux Sucks
Reply-To: bobh{at}haucks{dot}org
Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 01:43:43 GMT
On Mon, 16 Oct 2000 00:52:55 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>If you knew anything about Linsux, you would know that offline news
>reading is about as scarce as a do-do bird.
And then you name two...
>Of course you can use nightmares like Leafnode and Slrnpull to do the
>job, but PAN traps on me daily.
Hmm...I have leafnode running here. It connects every hour to grab the
latest news. When I get home in the evening, there your inane posts
are, just waiting to be replied to. Since Leafnode is an NNTP server,
I can read news from my wirless laptop on the back porch, as well as
from the PC's downstairs or upstairs.
How is this a "nightmare"?
>Agent is probobly the number one newsreader on the net.
I don't really care who is number one. Slrn works fine, as do many
others.
--
-| Bob Hauck
-| To Whom You Are Speaking
-| http://www.haucks.org/
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bob Hauck)
Subject: Re: Linux Sucks
Reply-To: bobh{at}haucks{dot}org
Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 01:43:46 GMT
On Sun, 15 Oct 2000 21:59:41 -0400, James E. Freedle II
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>As far as the stability of Linux is concerned, it is easy to have a
>stable system, just install an operating system with no useful
>applications (Linux), and useful applications I mean applications that
>normal everyday users will use) and have it sit there, then it will be
>stable.
I guess I better tell my daughter that she really isn't interested in
Wordperfect or Netscape or email or playing MP3's. I'll have to go
kick her off the computer though, as she is busy writing up a school
project and printing out the pictures we scanned to go with it. The
fact that she uses the computer must be confusing her, since the
reality is that there are "no useful applications" for Linux.
Are you just upset because your copy of "Kill the Bastards XVII for
Windows 98" won't run?
--
-| Bob Hauck
-| To Whom You Are Speaking
-| http://www.haucks.org/
------------------------------
From: Charlie Ebert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Slashdot strikes again!
Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 01:53:56 GMT
Interesting...
http://slashdot.org/
See article titled.
'Is There Anyone Left To Buy PCs?'
There's news in here, first page at time of this message, about
the desperate SLUMP in pc sales.
Seems they've finally hit a GLUT in the market for the PC.
So they're not turning over PC's like they once were.
And people selling operating systems will be hurting as they
won't be turning the buck's they expected.
Here's another area where Linux just doesn't seem to get hurt.
Most people who try Linux now-a-days are trying it on their
old computer. While it's true a few people will attempt to
load W2K on a pentium class machine, it won't run very well
as the memory requirements for W2k are higher than Linux's
memory requirements.
The cost is MUCH higher for W2k and the option most people
take is to buy a new PC to get their new Microsoft OS.
But if PC's aren't going to be selling very well then people
generally won't be getting W2k for Christmas.
There are remedies for slumps. Price drops are one remedy.
But Microsoft RUNS on cash. And price drops don't help their
battle with Linux distributions running at $5 to $90.
And just at the same time, Mandrake is coming out with their
7.2 version featuring the KDE2 desktop, the 2.4 kernel is planned,
Xfree 4.0, and just a ton of other neat networking options they
never offered before.
Redhat 7.0 is already out and ready fixed for a 2.4 kernel.
Caldera is likely to come out with their 2.4 version in full by
Christmas.
And Suse has an opportunity to release yet another distribution
by Christmas featuring the 2.4 kernel.
I don't know if the 2.4 kernel will be an official release by Christmas
but we can all hope.
And the 2.4 kernel is so fast, it just leaves Windows and the rest of
the world in the dust.
The only thing faster than Linux with a 2.4 kernel would be FreeBSD 4.1.
That's it. And considering the trade off in drivers and features, I'll
stick
with Linux.
It's going to be an incredibly exciting Christmas and an even better
2001!
The Linux Show earlier this year featured some commentary about the IDC
reports and IBM's intentions. I can't wait for them to get back on the
net
with their new web site.
The IDC reported that Linux has been the fastest growing operating
system
in history! There has never been another operating system which has
gained ground as quickly as Linux.
What exciting times we live in.
Charlie
------------------------------
From: "fmc" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Astroturfing
Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 01:54:31 GMT
lyttlec <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Chad Myers wrote:
> >
> > "lyttlec" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > Mike Byrns wrote:
> > > >
> > > > lyttlec wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > MS had to change the name. Now its Microsoft Certified Software
> > > > > Professional.
> > > >
> > > > No. They didn't. It's not changed at all. See
> > > >
> >
>http://www.microsoft.com/trainingandservices/default.asp?PageID=mcp&PageCal
l=mc
> > se&SubSite=cert>/mcse&AnnMenu=mcse
> > > >
> > > I'm only going by the titles of the *current* edition of books on the
> > > shelves at B&N and Borders. I've noticed that MSCE has been replaced
by
> > > MSCP.
> >
> > Book titles by which publisher?
> >
> > Microsoft Press still refers to it as MCSE.
> > http://mspress.microsoft.com/findabook/list/subject_category_T.htm
> >
> > If you go to:
> > http://www.microsoft.com/trainingandservices/default.asp?
> > PageID=mcp&PageCall=mcse&SubSite=cert/mcse&AnnMenu=mcse
> >
> > (URL wrapped for readability)
> >
> > You'll see that the certification is still titled MCSE.
> >
> > Given the facts, I'd say that you're lying or grossly misinformed.
> >
> > -Chad
> In the bookstores the new books have "MCSP" Microsoft Certified
> Solutions Provider or Microsoft Certified Software Professional, "MCDBA"
> Microsoft Certified Data Base Administrator, "MSNA" Microsoft Certified
> Network Administrator. The older books still show MSCE. But it doesn't
> matter much what MS says. Just don't call yourself an Engineer on your
> business card if you go into consulting.
I wouldn't blame Microsoft for calling software people "Engineers". It
started years ago in the Unix sector, and it continues to this day. Dice.com
has nearly 14,000 Unix Software Engineer positions listed.
fmc
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Terry Porter)
Subject: Re: Why the Linonuts fear me
Reply-To: No-Spam
Date: 17 Oct 2000 01:56:02 GMT
On Mon, 16 Oct 2000 23:44:05 GMT, Marc Alsina <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> by "Steve/Heather/Keys88/claire_whatever"
>> So, unlike Terry Porter who got pissed off back in 1997 at Windows, I
>> will continue to try current versions of Linux and Windows and maybe,
>> just maybe, someday I will switch to Linux.
>
> I do not know who the hell is Terry Porter, neither does it matter to me
>what he does; I just prove each version of any OS I get and like them all
>for some things, being Linux my favourite for some reasons, but I think you
>do not really want to listen to them.
I'm just a Linux user since 1997, and someone who loves replying to the above
Wintrolls posts. I do it cause he appears here under fake nakes, always the
same old stuff, but the newbies believe him, he *sounds* honest, as tho hes
actually interested in Linux, but as hes stated "I'm Linux's worst enemy".
Hell its probably Bill Gates, who would have the kinda time to post all that
crap ?
Kind Regards
Terry
--
**** ****
My Desktop is powered by GNU/Linux, and has been
up 1 day 21 hours 22 minutes
** Registration Number: 103931, http://counter.li.org **
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Matt Garman)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux?
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 02:03:45 GMT
On Tue, 17 Oct 2000 01:35:57 GMT, Grant Edwards <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> In article <8seufm$c7d$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, MH wrote:
> >Latex is fine. But try to give this to an experienced user of Word and it's
> >not going to happen in this life time.
> Learning to use LaTeX is certainly no more difficult than learning to use
> Word. Provided with a set of LaTeX templates, I've seen people with no
> typesetting or programming experience whatsoever producing within a day
> ...
I agree with you completely.
But why is it that the majority of the corporate world uses Word? Is that
all marketing in action?
I just find it so frustrating as an individual who is strictly a Linux
user when someone sends me a Word document or puts up some useful
information in Powerpoint or Excel form. It's honestly one of my biggest
fears when I graduate from college and join the "real world" that I'll
have to interface with MS products just to keep up with the operations of
my organization.
MG
--
Matt Garman, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
"I may make you feel, but I can't make you think."
-- Jethro Tull, "Thick as a Brick"
------------------------------
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